• July 23, 2018, 03:46:38 am
• Welcome, Guest. Please login or register.
Did you miss your activation email?

!!

TEMAC Forum Guests

Please take the time to Register for the forum, especially if you are a TEMAC club member.

This is one of the most active RC club forums in Ontario. Please participate in the discussion to help our great club to continue to grow.

Author Topic: RC Lander RCAF T-33 build,...err assembly,...project  (Read 563 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline Wingnutz

  • Ace
  • *****
  • Posts: 881
  • Karma: +8/-0
  • Real Name: Bill Quantock
  • TEMAC #: 122
RC Lander RCAF T-33 build,...err assembly,...project
« on: March 19, 2018, 12:21:58 am »
Been working on the above 90mm EDF model to add to my small collection of Canadian RC jet models. It's been sitting unopened in my basement since 2011 so it's hardly a new release. Quality of foam, fit-finish and the instructions isn't great but the good size of the model and it's Canadian paint scheme made it attractive for me.
The real aircraft was developed as an advanced trainer by Lockheed in the late 1940's by adding a second seat to the F-80 single seat fighter. T-33s were used by several countries, the US Navy, Air Force, National Guard and even Boeing where it served as a chase plane. Over 6000 were built worldwide.  Canadair built over 650 CT-133's for the RCAF.
RC Lander's model has a wingspan just over 1500 mm and a length of nearly 1600mm. It's beer cooler foam, with so-so fit and finish and has a reputation for visibly flexing wings. The RC Groups thread on the model has been helpful. I'm using a Dr Mad Thrust 90mm EDF, 120A ESC and 2x 4500 5S batteries in series for power. I 'll bench test the power system before installation to check that these components will work together...before they go in the model.
My model will be bungee dolly launched and belly landed as my local club field doesn't have geotex and the grass isn't golf green quality. I'll miss the runway take-offs and landings but I'll be able to cut retract weight and skip retract repairs.
The first picture is a model flown by a Burlington pilot...where I hope to end up.(model finished, not in Burlington!)
Second is the LARGE box in which the model arrived, complete with standard Canadian size reference! ;D
« Last Edit: March 19, 2018, 08:10:11 pm by Wingnutz »


DOWN WITH GRAVITY!

Offline Wingnutz

  • Ace
  • *****
  • Posts: 881
  • Karma: +8/-0
  • Real Name: Bill Quantock
  • TEMAC #: 122
Re: RC Lander RCAF T-33 build,...err assembly,...project
« Reply #1 on: March 19, 2018, 08:23:25 am »
Started with the wing as that's usually an easy beginning, especially with a single engine foamy.
This model? Not so simple!
The wing has diahedral, two halves with embedded spars being glued together and supported by ply diahedral braces. It attaches to the fuse with six wing bolts. Retract openings, flaps, ailerons and speed brake openings make it a bit Swiss cheese-like. RC Groups warns of a wing which flexes visibly in flight if not re-inforced beyond kit structure. With a heavy EDF and two 4500 5S batteries, I decided to follow one RC Groups post and started boring holes in the wing halves for carbon tube spars. I followed the photos to locate the holes and started boring with my sharpened tube. About three inches into each wing, I hit a ply rib! ****! Seems somewhere in mid production run, Lander decided to add ply ribs to strengthen the retract mounts! Bonehead here was too dumb to notice beforehand. Short story, the wing ended with the carbon tube spars re-located and large empty furrows in the top surface where I stubbornly persisted in trying to make a bad idea work. The furrows are visible in the moonshot photo. Grrr! >:(

« Last Edit: March 19, 2018, 09:54:02 am by Wingnutz »
DOWN WITH GRAVITY!

Offline bweaver

  • Ace
  • *****
  • Posts: 706
  • Karma: +6/-1
  • Real Name: Bruce Weaver
  • TEMAC #: 169
  • Started Flying RC: 1979
Re: RC Lander RCAF T-33 build,...err assembly,...project
« Reply #2 on: March 19, 2018, 09:22:30 am »
Looks like a great project Bill.  I am sure when it's finished, nothing you are growling about now will be noticeable.

I see you are undecided as to which NHL team to support.  ???

Offline Wingnutz

  • Ace
  • *****
  • Posts: 881
  • Karma: +8/-0
  • Real Name: Bill Quantock
  • TEMAC #: 122
Re: RC Lander RCAF T-33 build,...err assembly,...project
« Reply #3 on: March 19, 2018, 09:51:49 am »
Looks like a great project Bill.  I am sure when it's finished, nothing you are growling about now will be noticeable.

I see you are undecided as to which NHL team to support.  ???
Simply meeting my Canadian content requirement! :D
« Last Edit: March 19, 2018, 09:55:49 am by Wingnutz »
DOWN WITH GRAVITY!

Offline Wingnutz

  • Ace
  • *****
  • Posts: 881
  • Karma: +8/-0
  • Real Name: Bill Quantock
  • TEMAC #: 122
Re: RC Lander RCAF T-33 build,...err assembly,...project
« Reply #4 on: March 27, 2018, 05:18:57 pm »
Packaging and shipping, foam constuction and the required hollow fuse for EDF power all influenced the fuselage design of this model. The basic fuselage shell has nine pieces all epoxied together. I scored every joint to give the epoxy a better chance to bite (Thanks Michael!) and assembled the fuse on the wing to make sure it would fit. Final assembly awaits the arrival of a Y-harness with a reverser on one side to drive the elevators the same way and power system testing.
The first picture shows the cabon tube wing spars I added and the mess I made of the wing, trying to bore the holes for these and finding light ply spars in the way. Second is the fuse mounting, third the fuselage shell waiting for final assembly.
DOWN WITH GRAVITY!

Offline Wingnutz

  • Ace
  • *****
  • Posts: 881
  • Karma: +8/-0
  • Real Name: Bill Quantock
  • TEMAC #: 122
Re: RC Lander RCAF T-33 build,...err assembly,...project...HELP needed!
« Reply #5 on: March 27, 2018, 05:37:00 pm »
I've got the power system components ready to bench test but I'm not familiar with the YEP 120A OPTO HV ESC which I bought based on RCGroups recommendation. (I would have preferred a CC ESC but I'm trying to avoid another bank loan)
Other than the HK webpage, I can't find a manual.
Without it, I am baffled by the following;

1. Besides motor and battery leads, this thing has two servo style leads. Why?
2. The HK webpage suggests the ESC needs to be programmed. Dare I hook everything up and run it before I get into the joys of ESC programming?

Anybody have advice? Oscar are you there?
DOWN WITH GRAVITY!

Offline sihinch

  • TEMAC President
  • Global Moderator
  • Ace
  • *****
  • Posts: 3337
  • Karma: +25/-3
  • Real Name: Simon Hinchcliffe
  • TEMAC #: 124
  • Started Flying RC: 1987
Re: RC Lander RCAF T-33 build,...err assembly,...project
« Reply #6 on: March 27, 2018, 08:36:44 pm »
I have used YEP ESCs Bill. Don’t fear!

I have a 90A one that has 2 Servo leads. I just ignored one!

You can use it without programming. It comes like a heli ESC out of the box, I think, with a slow spool up. You can program is with the transmitter stick or the programming card (I have one.). I’ll see if I can find the manual.

Offline Wingnutz

  • Ace
  • *****
  • Posts: 881
  • Karma: +8/-0
  • Real Name: Bill Quantock
  • TEMAC #: 122
Re: RC Lander RCAF T-33 build,...err assembly,...project
« Reply #7 on: March 27, 2018, 11:05:16 pm »
Thanks Simon. Is your 90A YEP OPTO and if so did you use a BEC or a RX battery?
DOWN WITH GRAVITY!

Offline sihinch

  • TEMAC President
  • Global Moderator
  • Ace
  • *****
  • Posts: 3337
  • Karma: +25/-3
  • Real Name: Simon Hinchcliffe
  • TEMAC #: 124
  • Started Flying RC: 1987
Re: RC Lander RCAF T-33 build,...err assembly,...project
« Reply #8 on: March 28, 2018, 07:12:37 am »
Hi Bill,

Yes I’ve got the opto version. In a 60A too. I’ve used both a bec and battery with no problems.

I’ve sent you the programming instructions on email. They are YGE clones so you use their manual.

Cheers
S

Offline piker

  • Ace
  • *****
  • Posts: 2295
  • Karma: +18/-1
  • Real Name: Robert Pike
  • TEMAC #: 3
  • Started Flying RC: 1979
Re: RC Lander RCAF T-33 build,...err assembly,...project
« Reply #9 on: March 28, 2018, 11:11:21 am »
I think they offer two leads for higher amperage BEC's to share the load to the receiver.  If you consider that all your servos are getting their power through one set of wires from the BEC, it makes sense to offer a parallel path to share the load.   Just plug the extra lead into a spare slot in the Rx.

Warning... That's an assumption on my parts based on separate power BEC's that I have experience with.  Tread carefully   ;D

Offline Andy Hoffer

  • TEMAC Treasurer
  • Global Moderator
  • Ace
  • *****
  • Posts: 1428
  • Karma: +17/-2
  • Real Name: Andy Hoffer
Re: RC Lander RCAF T-33 build,...err assembly,...project
« Reply #10 on: March 28, 2018, 09:11:20 pm »
I think they offer two leads for higher amperage BEC's to share the load to the receiver.  If you consider that all your servos are getting their power through one set of wires from the BEC, it makes sense to offer a parallel path to share the load.   Just plug the extra lead into a spare slot in the Rx.

Warning... That's an assumption on my parts based on separate power BEC's that I have experience with.  Tread carefully   ;D

Hey @Wingnutz

@piker 's warning cannot be overemphasized!  He failed to heed his own admonition and fell off his scale bomb-bay ladder last month, damaging his King Kobra fuselage in the process!  (http://temac.ca/smf/index.php/topic,6508.msg42540.html#msg42540)

Please review the attached photos for evidence of experience with Build Eliminator Contraptions in order to properly assess the proferred adviced.    8)

Ever watching your 6 o'clock,

Alpha November Delta Yankee
« Last Edit: March 28, 2018, 09:13:31 pm by Andy Hoffer »

Offline Wingnutz

  • Ace
  • *****
  • Posts: 881
  • Karma: +8/-0
  • Real Name: Bill Quantock
  • TEMAC #: 122
Re: RC Lander RCAF T-33 build,...err assembly,...project
« Reply #11 on: March 29, 2018, 12:30:48 pm »
Thanks for the advice in the last few posts and for the programming instructions.(Simon) Careful re-reading of the HK item description indicates the second lead is likely the programming card lead. I'm going to use the OPTO feature(no BEC), RX battery and leave the red wire from the ESC plugged in. The only other OPTO experience I have is my 90mm F-86 and the red wire is detached.(CC ESC)
Now that I've found my Watts Up, I'll video the initial bench test...could be entertaining...I smoked one 100A ESC bench testing the F-86 power system!
DOWN WITH GRAVITY!

Offline piker

  • Ace
  • *****
  • Posts: 2295
  • Karma: +18/-1
  • Real Name: Robert Pike
  • TEMAC #: 3
  • Started Flying RC: 1979
Re: RC Lander RCAF T-33 build,...err assembly,...project
« Reply #12 on: March 29, 2018, 05:38:04 pm »
@piker 's warning cannot be overemphasized!  He failed to heed his own admonition and fell off his scale bomb-bay ladder last month, damaging his King Kobra fuselage in the process!  (http://temac.ca/smf/index.php/topic,6508.msg42540.html#msg42540)

Please review the attached photos for evidence of experience with Build Eliminator Contraptions in order to properly assess the proferred adviced.    8)

Ever watching your 6 o'clock,

Alpha November Delta Yankee

Hey!  It wasn't THAT ladder that I fell from.  I have two levels of ladders to get up to that dungeon!   :o

Offline Wingnutz

  • Ace
  • *****
  • Posts: 881
  • Karma: +8/-0
  • Real Name: Bill Quantock
  • TEMAC #: 122
Re: RC Lander RCAF T-33 build,...err assembly,...project
« Reply #13 on: April 02, 2018, 07:53:55 pm »
Tested the power system. Clamped the test stand to a portable workbench and took it all outside this morning. 10S is new territory for me, so checked everything twice before connecting the two 5S power batteries.
Didn't have enough hands to video, so took a photo.
Probably a good thing as the test went without drama...no smoking ESC, no exploding EDF fan, no flaming lipos...it all just worked...I was almost disappointed!
I pointed the exhaust out over the lake and although the trees on the small island in front of us are still standing, this thing pumps lots of air and I'm glad I didn't run it up in the house! Sound? Something between a Vulcan howl and a tortured leaf blower...a banshee wail maybe? My wife muttered something about ear plugs when I came back in.
The Watts Up meter recorded 65A @ around 40V for about 2600 watts...well within the limits of the ESC and EDF motor and if Dr Mad Thrust is any good at translating that electrical energy into thrust, adequate to fly a 8-10 pound model in at least scale fashion :)
The photo was actually taken this evening with my old iPad. I took this morning's photo with my iPhone and the file was too big for the TEMAC forum.
DOWN WITH GRAVITY!

Offline sihinch

  • TEMAC President
  • Global Moderator
  • Ace
  • *****
  • Posts: 3337
  • Karma: +25/-3
  • Real Name: Simon Hinchcliffe
  • TEMAC #: 124
  • Started Flying RC: 1987
Re: RC Lander RCAF T-33 build,...err assembly,...project
« Reply #14 on: April 02, 2018, 09:20:17 pm »
OMG! 2600 watts!? That’s massive! Very cool Bill.