Toronto Electric Model Aviation Club Forum

TEMAC Race Series => Piker Class Racing => Topic started by: sihinch on February 08, 2018, 07:22:33 pm

Title: 2018 Racing
Post by: sihinch on February 08, 2018, 07:22:33 pm
I'm writing this post because I want your opinion. A number of you have been asking about racing for this coming year, suggesting different formats or types of plane, so there is obvisouly interest out there.  And you must feel we haven't got it right yet.

I loved racing with the Piker class planes! I believe it improved my flying skills enourmously and it also gave my flying purpose. Plus, it was super, super fun. But I also know the planes were tough to build, repair and sometimes fly! And in the end the turnout for races became too low for a real race series.

The EF1 planes are much easier to fly, but can be tricky to land and also are much more expensive.  And they take up more sky.  We do have fun flying these, but again, never really got enough interest to have a full race series.

So - do you want to race?  With a course, and points? The suggestions so far are, with a few pros and cons:

1) Warbirds.  Would look amazing and most people have one.  But now we have different manufacturers giving different sizes, and some are 3S and others 4S.

2) Force RC Rare Bear - simple plane, 4S, pretty cheap, easyto repair.  But so far, no one has one, so you'd need to buy a new plane.

3) The new Stryker - I'm sure it will be a popular model and could be raced fairly easily, on either 3S or 4S. They would all be the same, but they would all look the same to start and again, you would need to buy a new plane!

Please, let me know your thoughts.  SHould we race. What with. Who would be interested?  Would you help out?

Thanks
Simon

Title: Re: 2018 Racing
Post by: Crazyflyer on February 08, 2018, 10:45:34 pm
I would be open to the new Stryker, even the Rare Bear.
Great thing about the Stryker is that we can also run FPV racing as well and it is pretty tough. Not that my planes eat dirt regularly :P

Stephan
Title: Re: 2018 Racing
Post by: Andy Hoffer on February 09, 2018, 12:48:04 am
Hey @sihinch,

How about the Warwings!  LOTS of people have those and they are cheap.  And you could have a LeMans start with any number of pilots racing at once, which would look fabulous, especially with the pretty tail streamers!!  See photo below, which shows what a typical racing pattern might look like!  This would be a real tribute to @bweaver , our masterful CFI, and Jack Higgins could officiate from above!!  And @Frank v B could set up a 5-minute epoxy kiosk for emergency repairs (artist's rendering provided)!  ;D

Andy
Title: Re: 2018 Racing
Post by: Crazyflyer on February 09, 2018, 07:29:30 am
I agree with Andy, but we should have a standard motor, prop and battery to make things fair.
Title: Re: 2018 Racing
Post by: sihinch on February 09, 2018, 08:49:04 am
Or, like Jack did, just a standard ESC to limit the watts. Then people can play with motor and prop and battery, and have a little more freedom = lower cost.
Title: Re: 2018 Racing
Post by: Andy Hoffer on February 09, 2018, 09:25:19 am
Or, like Jack did, just a standard ESC to limit the watts. Then people can play with motor and prop and battery, and have a little more freedom = lower cost.

Great idea!  Then @sihinch can do an ESC endurance test with one of his big-A 6S-5000 lipo bricks from his jets!!  Maybe with a bungee launch!  8)

I can't wait to photograph the scale smoke plume!!

Andy
Title: Re: 2018 Racing
Post by: bweaver on February 09, 2018, 10:34:25 am
Re: @Andy Hoffer idea. How about the Warwings!  LOTS of people have those and they are cheap.  And you could have a LeMans start with any number of pilots racing at once,

I like all of Andy's ideas, however I don't like his suggestion on the pattern and trailing the streamers as illustrated in the photo. I wouldn't want to confuse the participants as to which event they are flying in.

Further, I agree with a Lemans start, however with LOTS of people flying all at once, in order to avoid congestion, half of the racers should do a left hand circuit while the others do a right hand circuit...  (I would have to plan to make more Warwing kits for next year  :) )

@sihinch , On a more serious note, I would be interested in racing War Birds, stock or modified, such as a Parkzone, Eflite, or a Motion foamy, etc.  Some participants may wish to have a souped up war bird and furiously attempt winning every race. Others may like to fly a competitive war bird, but not be seriously chasing the 'GOLD'.  And finally others may participate and have just as much enjoyment flying a race(s) with only a stock war bird.   

When considering racing events of any kind, there are often many contestants in each race, but isn't there always only one winner? Some contestants may be out trying to winning, while many of the others are just enjoying doing it. Think of marathons, stock car races, etc.

Race events using war birds could involve 'trial events' first, leading up to final race(s) in different classes determined by the 'trials' outcomes.  For example, 'finals' could involve a Slow Class, Medium Slow Class, and a Faster Than Medium and Slow Class. This would encourage more people participate. (I know which class you would be in Simon.)  This would permit participants with different war birds entering in different classes.  The end result will be FUN.

How did that story go about the tortoise and the hare...?
Title: Re: 2018 Racing
Post by: Michael on February 09, 2018, 11:19:08 am
My 2 cents.

Parameters will vary depending on the intent.

If the intent is to have as many members participating as possible, and to have good numbers/turn-outs at race events, I would suggest 3-cell Parkzone/E-flite warbirds.

This would be slower than our other races, but fliers can learn to make sharper/more accurate turns.

*****

Warwings racing can still be done on a more casual basis, but I'm sure the races themselves won't be causal.  ;D

Occasional EF1 racing will happen anyway.
Title: Re: 2018 Racing
Post by: Andy Hoffer on February 09, 2018, 12:00:55 pm
Wow! SO many good ideas. 

Bruce's  "Think of marathons, stock car races, etc." evokes visions of thoroughly entertaining (especially for spectators) demolition derbies!  His bi-directional pattern suggestion is absolutely brilliant!!

And it might be interesting to engage Gil Elgez to do a 3D-printed clone of Simon - then we could all watch Simon race himself!  Imagine the flight line tension!!   Again, a fantastic entertainment prospect for everyone!

Andy
Title: Re: 2018 Racing
Post by: octagon on February 12, 2018, 10:10:46 am
My 2 cents.

Parameters will vary depending on the intent.

If the intent is to have as many members participating as possible, and to have good numbers/turn-outs at race events, I would suggest 3-cell Parkzone/E-flite warbirds.

Simon, when I brought up the idea to you Michaels idea is what I had in mind. You can find video's of it on the intertube and it looks like fun. Most folks will have a 3s warbird parkflyer laying around somewhere, and I just thought as they fly so well (mostly) are easy to fix that it would be a good way to have a bit of racing without the time and cost involved in pure racing planes.





Title: Re: 2018 Racing
Post by: sihinch on February 12, 2018, 02:44:25 pm
I’ve had an idea.....how about this?

We run 3 different “trial” events and see how well they are attended and how people like them - one with 3S warbirds, one with 3S warnings and another with 4S Strykers or wings? Then people who have the planes can participate and we try each formula proposed?

I like that idea! Sometimes I amaze myself!!!
Title: Re: 2018 Racing
Post by: Michael on February 12, 2018, 03:46:43 pm
OK, Simon, but you've got to promise not to feel bad when my Texan beats your Mustang.
Title: Re: 2018 Racing
Post by: bweaver on February 12, 2018, 06:05:55 pm
Three cell parkzone warbirds sound good. 

Michael sounds like he is challenging Simon.  There may be lots more challenges where that came from.  For example, I'll throw my P47 into a challenge of this nature. When my P47 is racing, I will expect to hear many pilots saying "Get out of my way!"  >:(
Title: Re: 2018 Racing
Post by: Palkina on February 12, 2018, 06:54:07 pm
Let's do not forget that Michael also challenged every warwing owner. The competition will be "feroz" !!!
Title: Re: 2018 Racing
Post by: Andy Hoffer on February 12, 2018, 07:08:26 pm
I will hang out in the corn to take photos!!

Andy
Title: Re: 2018 Racing
Post by: bweaver on February 12, 2018, 10:35:41 pm
Let's do not forget that Michael also challenged every warwing owner. The competition will be "feroz" !!!

Let's hope so! 

feroz - Diccionario Inglés-Español WordReference.com
www.wordreference.com/es/en/translation.asp?spen=feroz
English: blistering - cut-throat - ferocious - cutthroat - fierce - vicious - furious - scathing - cutthroat competition - hatchet job - raging hunger - slam - wild beast.

I am adding "and fun".
Title: Re: 2018 Racing
Post by: octagon on February 13, 2018, 08:24:09 am
I am going to put racing numbers on my Parkzone clipped wing Spitfire!
Title: Re: 2018 Racing
Post by: sihinch on March 05, 2018, 09:41:13 am
OK everyone, here's a sneak peek ar what we're planning for this year, so you can think about what you might use. I will not put a lot of focus on rules or constraints.

The emphasis will be on trying different format while having fun.

In April, when the weather warms up, we will hold a warwing race.  No prop, motor or ESC conditions, just use your warwing with a 3S lipo. We will do 10 laps of our field, with a coordinated launch of upto 5 racers per heat.  So get your warwings built!
http://temac.ca/smf/index.php/topic,6176.0.html

In May, on the same day as "Mayden Fest" when we encourage you to try your new planes, we will hold a warbird race.  Again, very few limits or constraints - must be a warbird between 1m and 1.3m wingspan and use 3S lipo.  Other than that, use what you want.  We will do 10 laps again with up to 5 racers per heat.

Once we see how these races go, we can then talk about what we may want to do throughout the season.  Heck, we could even continue with both types of race for 2018 and have a league table for each format.  We could even throw in an EF1 race or 2 too.

Anyway - prepare your 3S Warwings and Warbirds for racing!  :D
Title: Re: 2018 Racing
Post by: bweaver on March 05, 2018, 10:47:59 am
Excellent plan Simon.  I can't wait for the Races to begin.
Title: Re: 2018 Racing
Post by: sihinch on March 11, 2018, 04:59:38 pm
To further encourage participation, we will remove one further limitation from the warbird class. There is no wingspan limitation. Simply a 3S warbird.

Title: Re: 2018 Racing
Post by: Frank v B on March 11, 2018, 10:10:52 pm
Simon,

OK... wheels or no wheels?   Retracts allowed?   Hand-launch allowed?

Frank
Title: Re: 2018 Racing
Post by: sihinch on March 12, 2018, 12:31:34 pm
Hi Frank,

We're trying to make this inclusive and fun.  And simple.  I may not have all the answers now...... ;)

....but the aim is to get peope trying it.  Obvisouly the questions you asked will influence our start. 

So, in the spirit of more the merrier, we will allow warbirds with wheels, retracts and no wheels, and have a racing start from the center of the field.  :D
Title: Re: 2018 Racing
Post by: Andy Hoffer on March 12, 2018, 04:08:35 pm
Hi Frank,

We're trying to make this inclusive and fun.  And simple.  I may not have all the answers now...... ;)

....but the aim is to get peope trying it.  Obvisouly the questions you asked will influence our start. 

So, in the spirit of more the merrier, we will allow warbirds with wheels, retracts and no wheels, and have a racing start from the center of the field.  :D

Ahhhh, so sweet!  More foam fodder and balsa bits for my camera!!!   8)

Andy Hoffer
Title: Re: 2018 Racing
Post by: Frank v B on March 12, 2018, 07:46:24 pm
Simon,

i agree with you.  I just wanted you to think about it before the racing starts.  We will work it out on the day....as we always do.

Andy, which BBQ sauce do prefer with your foam?? ;D

Frank
Title: Re: 2018 Racing
Post by: Andy Hoffer on March 12, 2018, 08:40:28 pm
@Frank v B ,

Re BBQ sauce, , I am really partial to Heinz EPO Foam Safe!   :D

Andy
Title: Re: 2018 Racing
Post by: Crazyflyer on March 14, 2018, 03:53:31 pm
Hi Guys,
Below is a link to an FPV wing racing organization with different classes, it would be great if we can get the FPV enthusiasts together for racing FPV wings as well at TEMAC.
They show some different course layouts that would be fun to try, we can easily put a few flags in the field without messing with the circuit:
https://fpvwra.net/spec-wing-courses/

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_ExKyrosl5w
Title: Re: 2018 Racing
Post by: Ededge2002 on April 03, 2018, 11:12:57 pm
Can I paint insignias on my giant Multiplex Mentor and call it a warbird?  Or what about a gws ME109?


giggling

Im so happy to see you guys are going to continue racing!  For those of you that havent tried it I agree with Simon that it will improve your flying.
Title: Re: 2018 Racing
Post by: sihinch on June 04, 2018, 12:36:30 pm
I'm hoping to fly this Saturday, 9th June.  Why don't we try another Warwing race?

Just bring your Warwings out and throughout the afternoon we will do some race laps.  It's awesome fun with a warwing.  ;D
Title: Re: 2018 Racing
Post by: bweaver on June 04, 2018, 01:02:55 pm
What a great idea Simon.  Everyone is welcome to give it a try.  Warwing racing is a blast, I mean exhilarating.  I can't wait.

Having a Warwing with you and failure to participate may result in some lucky person walking away with their Warwing remaining intact, but also be awarded the Non-Prestigious Chicken Award. This lucky/unlucky individual will wear the award with pride/shame, only to pass it off personally to some other wimp/unworthy adversary at another scheduled Racing or Combat Challenge.   :)
Title: Re: 2018 Racing
Post by: Ededge2002 on June 04, 2018, 08:04:13 pm
What a great idea Simon.  Everyone is welcome to give it a try.  Warwing racing is a blast, I mean exhilarating.  I can't wait.

Having a Warwing with you and failure to participate may result in some lucky person walking away with their Warwing remaining intact, but also be awarded the Non-Prestigious Chicken Award. This lucky/unlucky individual will wear the award with pride/shame, only to pass it off personally to some other wimp/unworthy adversary at another scheduled Racing or Combat Challenge.   :)

Kinda like the yellow jersey in cycling!