As a lot of people know I've been building a Hawker Typhoon and the thread is over on the EMFSO website. Since no one (including myself) seems to frequent that forum much these days I thought I'd bring it over to "where the action is". :)
For those who might be interested in how it started and its progression up to this point you can check it out at http://emfso.org/smf/index.php?topic=2951.0 (http://emfso.org/smf/index.php?topic=2951.0)
There's nothing much to report as far as progress is concerned since my last update simply because I've been extrememly busy this year with a two year old, my business and now looking for a new house. In any event, I have been waiting on some final parts to come in before I attempt to at least get this to a flying state to get the maiden out of the way!
As some might recall the original goal was to get it all done by Kingston, then by the TEMAC warbirds day and then the TEMAC funfly! Needless to say I have not met any of those completion goals and doubt very much that it will get completed this year. >:( HOWEVER I do still have a goal of at least getting it to maiden before the season is done so that I can take my time over the winter to complete it.
So ... stay tuned. ;)
Colin
P.S. Attached is the plane I'm trying to replicate.
The Typhoon is one of my favs. Too bad your build thread got left behind as it were. I'm sure you could summarize the key milestones from the other thread and add them here for completeness.
I'm planning on doing the same with my charging station thread.
Ben
Ok here we go again... the Typhoon's back up on the bench. :) Now I just have to remember where I left off and TRY to get back up to speed. I had a bit of a scare the other day when the EMFSO site was down for awhile and we were all speculating as to whether it was down forever or not. So ... I've decided to try to take Ben's advice and "paste" all those posts from the original thread to over here just in case that actualy does happen in the future.
Why is it important to me to do this? Well, the primary reason I started it in the first place was to keep ME on track and I was actually shocked to see how much interest it garnered! Anyway, I find it to be a great reference point since the build has been such a long and complex one (for me anyways) and its good to be able to check back as to how I did this or that. Now after such a long layoff it is proving to be even more valuable! Anyways ... here goes ...
Colin
November 18, 2011, 09:11:30 am » Well, the commitment has been made so there's no turning back now! My 1/6.78 scale Hawker Typhoon kit is on its way ... this is a full composite kit (wings and all) and should be a beaut when its done ... if I'm up to the task. I say "if" because even though I've made extensive modifications to a bunch of ARFs over the years ... this is the first time I'm attempting a full build of any kind much less one that's even remotely SCALE! (http://emfso.org/smf/Smileys/classic/grin.gif)
This thread is not intended to be a "build thread" but rather something that I hope will keep ME on task since I tend to be a procrastinator. Every year I'm always late to the game in terms of things to fly because I've wasted the winter months when I should be putting my stuff together by thinking ... oh I've got lots of time. Before you know it the whole season is pretty much gone before I finally get all the planes that I intended to fly that season in the air.
This way ... I'm hoping that since I'll be posting here from time to time any progress that is being made, (even if just to post a pic of a part that came in!) it may evoke people's interest and that should keep me on track for the next stage/phase.
This is going to be an ambitious project for me since a lot of the stuff that I intend to do with it is gonna be made from scratch. As I've mentioned the kit itself is somewhat "ARF LIKE" in the sense that it's not something to "build up" (it's fully composite) so I don't have to worry about the main "airframe" as such. However the list below shows the extent of the fabrications that I intend to do (listed not in any particular order) to bring it to the final product. (http://emfso.org/smf/Smileys/classic/smiley.gif)
1. Scale cockpit
2. Scale antenna
3. Scale armament (cannons etc)
4. Landing lights
5. Painting and weathering
6. Scale exhaust stacks
7. Retractable tailwheel
8. Retractable main wheel well doors
9. Integrated control surface mechanisms and battery hatch
10. Retractable canopy (canopy to be procured but retract mechanism to be fabricated.)
11. Scale three blade prop (to be procured not fabricated.)
12. Scale Pilot (to be procured not fabricated.)
13. Scale custom spinner (to be procured not fabricated.)
14. Scale custom retractable 95 degree main LG. (to be procured not fabricated ... Typhoons had about a 1 degree anhedral on the inner portion of the wing so "regular" 90 degree gear wouldn't look square)
I hope to have it "flyable" by the start of the season (april/May) but 100% completed by the Kingston Funfly (late June/early July) Hey if I do a good job maybe I can win an award for this plane at the Temac funfly next year ... it'd be a nice change from the only award that I've ever won in this hobby ... BEST CRASH AWARD! ;D
December 04, 2011, 10:07:47 pm »
Parts are starting to trickle in ... got my struts and my 95 degree Lado electric retracts today. (Yup, Canada post delivered them today ... ;D
December 09, 2011, 01:17:20 pm »
--------------
So now it looks like I will be making my own spinner! This plane calls for a 4.72inch spinner ... not 4.25. 4.5, 4.75 or 5 ... 4.72". (http://emfso.org/smf/Smileys/classic/rolleyes.gif) Needless to say it's somewhat uncommon and expensive! I originally was ok with buying one (costs about 75 bucks in hand) but then I realized that I need TWO because I intend to eventually use the scale three blade prop which obviously calls for a spinner with three cutouts.
However since I will be starting with a two blader to see how the plane flys (before comitting to the $80 prop! yikes! (http://emfso.org/smf/Smileys/classic/shocked.gif) ) and get comfortable with it, I'll also need a two blade spinner. Course I could always fly it initially with a mis sized spinner but that just won't be right. (http://emfso.org/smf/Smileys/classic/wink.gif) Solution ... make my own spinner. NOw THAT should be entertaining! (http://emfso.org/smf/Smileys/classic/shocked.gif) (http://emfso.org/smf/Smileys/classic/grin.gif)
Colin
December 31, 2011, 05:40:41 pm » -----------------------------
Well, I found one that's the right shape AND size and it only cost about $5. (http://emfso.org/smf/Smileys/classic/wink.gif) It's "based" on a HobbyKing spinner. (I'll explain later (http://emfso.org/smf/Smileys/classic/wink.gif) )
In any event, most of my parts have now come in and it seems based on my calculations that she'll come in around EIGHTEEN pounds! At a wing area of 857" that's a porky plane coming in at a whopping wingloading of 48.39oz per sq ft. Anyway, the cube wing loading is more accurate as to how a plane should handle and that wasn't as bad at 19.8.
Still high but apparently manageble. I say apparently manageble because I've been following a number of KMP Typhoon threads (since I'm now totally convinced that this IS a KMP clone) and they have been coming in at up to 19 to 20 pounds! Apparently the thickness of the wing makes it much more forgiving than other planes would be at this wing loading.
The following is its kit weights:
FUSE – 29.5oz
Center Wing – 30.2oz
Left Wing – 12.5oz
Right Wing – 12.35oz
Rear wing tube – 1.1ozs
Wing joiners – 2.6ozs
Gear covers – 1.85ozs
Pushrods – 1.7ozs
Servo covers and blocks - .75ozs
Radiator cover - .75ozs
Cowl – 7.9oz
Exhaust – 2ozs
Left Stab – 3.25ozs
Right stab – 3.3ozs
Rudder – 2.15ozs
Canopy – 2.1oz
Wheel Well covers - 6ozs
TOTAL KIT WEIGHT = 120ozs
The following is its COMPONENT weights:
SUPPO 7035/8 190KV – 44ozs (WITH CONNECTORS AND MOUNT?)
Motor mount standoffs and 8-32 bolts: 4.44oz???
CC 85A HV ESC: 4.2ozs
Turnigy 20 X 10 gas wood prop 4ozs
4.72" diameter (120mm x 103mm) 3 blade spinner: 5oz???
Zippy 30C 12s 5800mah battery: 60ozs
Airtronics 2.4 Ghz 8ch Receiver: .46oz
1 HS-5625MG servo: 2ozs (for elevator)
1 HS-5625MG servo: 2ozs (for rudder)
4 HS-5485HB servos (1.6oz each): 6.4ozs (2 for flaps and 2 for ailerons)
Hercules SUPER Bec: 1.5ozs
LADO Electric Retracts/LADO Struts/Hobby King 4" wheels: 15.5ozs
Electric tail retract/Strut/1¾" wheel: 2.5ozs???
Misc (glue, servo extensions, pushrods and servo screws etc): 8ozs???
Pilot, cockpit and cannons: 8ozs???
TOTAL COMPONENT WEIGHT = 168oz??? OR 10lbs 8ozs???
TOTAL KIT WEIGHT = 120ozs
TOTAL AUW = 288ozs? or 18lbs?
It'll take some real creative fabrication of the stuff that I intend to do to keep this weight down to 18 pounds but I'm gonna give it my best shot. First thing I'm gonna tackle is that spinner ... wish me luck!
More to come ...
Colin
January 02, 2012, 08:31:28 pm »
Ok ... so I've started my attempt at fabricating the scale spinner that I need for this plane .... it needs to be 120mm by 103mm ... it's wide and somewhat stubby. (http://emfso.org/smf/Smileys/classic/smiley.gif) Since I've never done anything like this before I decided that I'd give myself a fighting chance of doing a half decent job of it by starting out with a pre-existing spinner! (http://emfso.org/smf/Smileys/classic/wink.gif) Since Hobbyking sells a nylon spinner ($5 ... whoo hoo!) that's quite near the dimension in length that I need, (103mm) I decided that I'd use that one as my "base".
Here it is ...
Colin
January 02, 2012, 08:52:38 pm »
So the whole idea was to use the HK spinner as a "base" and use pink foam to "build it up" to the desired shape and height that I wanted. The plan was to cut a series of foam "rings" of decending diameters (corresponding with the spinner) which would then be molded and glued to the Hk spinner itself. See attached pics and video. First couple pics is the actual base of the HK spinner with its foam "ring" already glued, filled and sanded to the exact diameter that I need.
Third and fourth pics show the first ring attached to the bottom of the spinner itself (not the base) ... THIS ring had to be perfectly level and even in thickness because all the other rings would acend off of it. Simpler than it sounds since pink foam tends to be fairly uniform in its thickness. (http://emfso.org/smf/Smileys/classic/wink.gif) The video shows the second ring being cut out and rough fitted.
http://youtu.be/pSPAP4Ft-90 (http://youtu.be/pSPAP4Ft-90)
Colin
January 02, 2012, 10:37:51 pm »
Now we have the built up spinner that has been roughly cut to shape and then sanded ... next will be to apply filler ...
Last pic shows it partially built up. One of the challenges I have is to maintain the screw holes thoughout the now built up spinner. The length of the holes now will be quite a bit deeper than the original holes and I don't have a "skinny" screwdriver that's long enough to down deep enough to reach the screws. So, I'll either have to find a screwdriver that is long enough AND skinny enough for me to be able to reach the screws to tighten the spinner cone to its base or ... I may just convert this spinner to one which tightens down through the middle via a prop nut and bolt. (hence the hole I drilled in the middle at the tip "just in case" I decide to eventually do that.)
First pic ... rough cut to shape
Second ... same from the top
Third ... after first sanding
January 03, 2012, 05:11:17 pm » Quote from: ededge2002 on January 03, 2012, 03:48:54 pm (http://emfso.org/smf/index.php?topic=2951.msg13634#msg13634)
If your going into production Colin I will take two! Can you make them 36D ?
Hmmmm ... that's funny! I dunno if this one will even turn out (no pun intended) ok. The hard part will be getting it to run "true" and then getting it balanced. So far I'm just shaping etc by eye. My kingdom for a lathe ....
Colin
January 04, 2012, 05:00:52 pm » I actually have a drill press ands have just started using it with the bolt through the back plate as Rob suggested. (http://emfso.org/smf/Smileys/classic/wink.gif) Well, my first "problem" (due to inexperience of course) has arisen. (exploded actually (http://emfso.org/smf/Smileys/classic/smiley.gif) ) BEFORE using the drill press I was actually using a spare motor as a my spinning apparatus and while running up the spinner at a somewhat high RPM (you know "testing" the structural integrity of my mod so far! lol) the base foam ring exploded off of the base with a LOUD pop and a shower of foam and filler.
If I has used some common sense I would have realized that that ring needs to be made of something a bit stronger than foam since it has very little surface area (its about 6mm thick - see pic)) with which to adhere to the spinner back plate. In any event, I now have to decide what to use to replace it. Any thoughts? Firberglass, plywood or would even a balsa ring soaked in CA be adequate?
Colin
January 04, 2012, 07:22:59 pm »
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Foam again with a layer of light glass cloth top and bottom would make it a lot tougher I would think. Might even consider vacuum bagging the finished result as it would add a lot of strength at little weight. Member#2003
Formosa Racing #666
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« Reply #26 on: January 04, 2012, 07:44:55 pm » Yeah ... I thought of that because the actual spinner itself will be glassed. However that bottom ring is in such an awkward position that it would be almost imossible to glass it. I'm leaning towards light ply ... course that comes at the cost of being much more difficult to shape and sand. (http://emfso.org/smf/Smileys/classic/sad.gif)
Colin
January 05, 2012, 08:52:17 am »
Two questions:
1. How would you guys cut out a lite ply disc of this size? I use a dremel cutoff wheel but is there any other more precise way of doing it? (My kingdom for a scroll saw ... damn I should've bought Bruce's ... Eric where are ya? (http://emfso.org/smf/Smileys/classic/grin.gif) )
2. Can a lopsided (in shape) spinner run "true"? In other words can you have a balanced spinner that's not perfectly symetrical, or is that an oxymoron? (http://emfso.org/smf/Smileys/classic/wink.gif)
Colin
January 09, 2012, 09:50:06 am »
Slow progress on the spinner ... working on multiple projects at the same time. (see some "bling" being added to the Decathlon (http://emfso.org/smf/Smileys/classic/grin.gif) )I did luck out on getting the spinner nut situation sorted out though. To recap, I decided not to go with the original way that the spinner attaches to the backplate (via four little screws) as per the before mentioned challenges that would represent. (besides the screw holes would'nt look as scale (http://emfso.org/smf/Smileys/classic/wink.gif) )
This presented another challenge in that I couldn't find a prop nut that was large enough for a 12mm motor shaft! I was told (and confirned after much research) that the biggest typically made was 10mm and so I would have to have something like that custom made. Seeing that that would cost me a good $100 and the motor cost a little more than that I didn't think that was a viable option.
I then thought why not connect the spinner bolt straight onto the shaft itself (which is fairly common.) This would only involve tapping the shaft itself to accept the spnner bolt. Well, since I knew noone with a lathe ... I considered a machine shop ... same issue ... an hours charge just to do that. Probably more money that the motor was worth. Anyways, long story short I was recommended to a guy who does top notch machine work (he actually scratch builds steam locomotives etc) who would do it for about fifteen bucks! SCORE! (http://emfso.org/smf/Smileys/classic/grin.gif) So now its just up to me to get this darn thing symetrical and spinning true. More to come ...
January 09, 2012, 07:51:41 pm » Ok, got the backplate ring re-done ... used lite ply and had to painstakingly cut it out with my dremel tool. Very pleased with how it turned out in the end ... quite shocked actually with how precise I was able to get it given the tools on hand.
Colin
January 10, 2012, 09:39:13 am »
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Wow nice fit! is the rest of the plane finished yet? LOL your practicly cheating as i dont think winter has even started yet
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Thanks Ed ... it took a lot of elbow grease to get that fit. I can't believe that I originally made that ring out of foam ... what was I thinking? (http://emfso.org/smf/Smileys/classic/rolleyes.gif) Because of the small surface area of attachment lite ply is the strongest and cleanest solution so it's a good thing that the foam one exploded when it did! (http://emfso.org/smf/Smileys/classic/grin.gif)
As for the rest of the plane being finished ... at this rate I'd be lucky to get it done by my original deadline. I'm still not done with this darn spinner and that wasn't even on my list of things to fabricate (http://emfso.org/smf/index.php?topic=2951.msg13400#msg13400)! Hopefully I'll have some more time today to give the cone itself its final sanding and then get it glassed.
Colin
January 15, 2012, 02:05:09 pm » Well, got some time to get back to it and it's coming along. Just some touchups now (where I've circled) and a final sanding/polishing then we can get to the part that will make or break this project ... the balancing!
Colin
March 08, 2012, 11:41:19 pm » As I'd mentioned from the get go this really wasn't a "build thread" but really something to keep ME accountable. (http://emfso.org/smf/Smileys/classic/wink.gif) Having said that I'll just be posting about the "non routine" parts of the build.
Latest update ...
It's painted but I have some touchups to do. Also now working on the retractable tailwheel which will also be an electrical retract and will retract forwards into the fuse like the real one does. The reason I mentioned that is because this presents it's own challenges which I will attempt to document in subsequent posts.
Colin.
March 11, 2012, 11:36:01 am »
Ok so here's how this whole electric tailwheel retract thing went down. (http://emfso.org/smf/Smileys/classic/wink.gif) First off since I had electric retracts for the mains I thought that if I got the tailwheel to electrically retract (coupled with the mains) that would be kinda cool and look somewhat scale. I didn't want to spend a lot of money at it since the whole project is putting me in the poor house as it is. (http://emfso.org/smf/Smileys/classic/wink.gif)
Knowing that the tailwheel wouldn't have to take a lot of force I figured a cheapie Hobby King electric retract (http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/store/uh_viewItem.asp?idproduct=17538)could do the trick. It was rated for up to five pounds or so and since this was gonna be a tailwheel that should be well within its specs. Cost me all of seven bucks or so shipped! (http://emfso.org/smf/Smileys/classic/grin.gif) The fact that it didn't come with a shaft/strut wasn't a problem since I intended to make my own.
OK, the first challenge was that since this was going to be a "steerable" tailwheel it had to be able to rotate. This posed a problem because the retract was obviously set up to accept a shaft that would be FIXED within its assemply. In other words the retract would have two grub screws to PREVENT the shaft from rotating or falling out!
The way I solved this problem was that I "turned" out a groove in my shaft/strut (a regular 8-32 bolt?) so that when inserted into the retract the two grub screws (which I replaced with regular screws) would sit snugly in the groove and prevent it from falling/coming out of the retract while still allowing it to swivel/rotate. Hopefully the pic will make this clearer. (http://emfso.org/smf/Smileys/classic/smiley.gif)
Colin
March 11, 2012, 12:10:14 pm »
Since I was trying to make this as scale as I possibly could I decided to try to make a trailing link oleo type tailwheel assembly. (http://emfso.org/smf/Smileys/classic/shocked.gif) Well, I should tell you that I tried at first to locate such an assembly. I figured that a nose wheel one (like the jets use) would be great ... I found this one.
However these were always out of stock and again in the interest of saving some money I decided to try to make one on my own. If they ever come back in stock I may actually switch mine out. (I doubt it though (http://emfso.org/smf/Smileys/classic/wink.gif) )
Well, needless to say if you're gonna be doing any precision work (as I imagined this was going to be) you'd better have precision tools. I have none. (http://emfso.org/smf/Smileys/classic/grin.gif) What you are about to see is made strictly with materials I had at hand, and regular tools. (hacksaw, drill press etc) No fancy machining was performed here. Looks kinda crude but is very functional. I like to call it "seniors's scale"! In other words if you can see it without your glasses then it will look good. (http://emfso.org/smf/Smileys/classic/grin.gif) Lol!
So the idea was to make two strut pieces/braces (since the wheel would sit in the middle) bridge them with crossbolts and somehow connect this "assembly" to the strut/shaft. Now since this was a "trainling link" setup the strut piece assemply had to somehow be able to swilvel where it connects to the strut to end up in the trailing link position. I therefore had to make a coupler or "bridge" between the two.
Of course I looked around my shop for a piece of beautifully machined aluminum bar stock but failing to find that I made it from a piece of wood. Lol! (http://emfso.org/smf/Smileys/classic/grin.gif) You will notice in the pics of the crude block of wood ... there is also a pin. This pin was to be attached to the wood coupler in order to stop the actual tailwheel and struts from rotating all the way around. I called it a "strut stop". Subsequent pics will help to make this clear.
Colin
March 11, 2012, 12:36:34 pm »
Ok next I tapped a hole in the coupler to accept my strut/shaft. Next was to try to fabricate the "oleo" dampener. Long story short? The geometry was too challenging given the space and angles that I had to work with. Therefore the next best thing was for me to attach a spring on the opposite side (the outside of the assembly) to keep the training link under tension.
This is where my "strut stop" was to play a role. Because the spring was on the outside of the assembly, (the convex side) in the "relaxed" position (no weight on the tailwheel ie: when retracted) the spring would pull it straight ... IF there wasn't a "stop". (http://emfso.org/smf/Smileys/classic/wink.gif)
Anyways, I think it came together quite well, my only disappointment was not being able to attach the oleo dampener since the spring (while being just as functional) makes the whole thing look rather crude. (http://emfso.org/smf/Smileys/classic/sad.gif) All in all though it works quite well, looks fairly decent and retracts well. Best part is it came in under the weight that I allotted for it, (1.95ozs as opposed to my projected 2.5ozs) which is great as this plane needs a LOT of weight in the front. So any weight you can shave off the tail end is a huge benefit. (http://emfso.org/smf/Smileys/classic/smiley.gif) I'm debating whether to add retractable gear doors as well which I orginally decided against because of weight but now ... hmmm
Anyways .. at this rate I should be done by 2013! lol!
Colin
March 14, 2012, 09:52:28 am » Got the retract mounted and it seems to be working quite well. Just have to hook it up to the pull pull lines that it will share with the rudder.
Colin
March 14, 2012, 09:53:15 am » Now you see it ...
March 14, 2012, 09:54:29 am » Now you don't! (http://emfso.org/smf/Smileys/classic/grin.gif)
March 14, 2012, 09:59:55 am » Here's a video of it in operation (http://youtu.be/Ua4Dn4P_83Y). Notice a little bit of a jam on retraction, that's because the pull pull lines aren't connected to keep in from swivelling yet. Even though the lines will be slack upon retraction thereby not providing much tension to keep the tailwheel straight, the weight and drag of the lines themselves should do the trick. In the unlikely event that they do not ... I'll just install some "guide rails" to keep the tailwheel on track.
Colin.
March 19, 2012, 11:48:32 pm »
Just finished with the exhaust stacks. (http://emfso.org/smf/Smileys/classic/grin.gif) It's made up of twelve pieces of aluminum tubing pressed in at the ends. These are attached to a couple of lite ply bases and the whole thing is quite light.
Colin
March 20, 2012, 12:04:53 am » Here you see I've added the "welds" by adding a rough line of epoxy on each exhaust. Next I painted them with a base black coat on in preparation for ...
March 20, 2012, 12:22:45 am »
The final "weathered" look! (http://emfso.org/smf/Smileys/classic/grin.gif)
March 30, 2012, 10:40:57 am » Hardly seem to be making any progress but here's my report so far:
1. Retractable canopy
2. Scale cockpit
3. Scale antenna
4. Landing lights
5. Painting and weathering
6. Scale exhaust stacks
7. Retractable tail wheel
8. Retractable wheel well doors
9. Scale three blade prop
10. Scale cannons
11. Scale Pilot
12. Scale custom spinner
Colin (http://emfso.org/smf/Smileys/classic/smiley.gif)
Hey Colin,
I'm glad to see you're back at it. Lookin' forward to some fresh progress!
Robert
Yup ... gotta try to finish this beast cause I have four others waiting to be worked on. :o Ok so on with the "thread transfer". ;D
March 30, 2012, 10:44:49 am » Next up ... #8. Retractable wheel well doors. Working on the retract mains right now.
April 08, 2012, 09:19:27 pm »
Well, I found a way to chop more than a POUND off the "projected" AUW! How? Drop from the 60oz 12S pack to a 10S! There are a couple of other areas of savings but that's 14ozs right there! This move will also save me about $150 ... in addition to the batteries being cheaper (10S 5800mah as opposed to 12S 5800mah) now I don't have to get the very expensive Hercules UBEC I would have needed. (which works for up to 14S packs)
The following is its kit weights:
Fuse – 29.5oz
Center Wing – 30.2oz
Left Wing – 12.5oz
Right Wing – 12.35oz
Stab joiner tube – 1.1ozs
Wing joiners – 2.6ozs
Pushrods – 1.7ozs
Servo covers and blocks - .75ozs
Radiator cover - .75ozs
Cowl – 7.9oz
Exhaust – 2ozs
Left Stab – 3.25ozs
Right stab – 3.3ozs
Rudder – 2.15ozs
Canopy – 1.75oz
Gear covers – 1.85ozs
Fabricated supplementary gear covers – 1oz?
Fabricated wheel well covers – 1oz?
TOTAL KIT WEIGHT = 115.65ozs?
The following is now its COMPONENT weights:
SUPPO 7035/8 190KV – 44ozs (WITH CONNECTORS AND MOUNT?)
Motor mount standoffs and 8-32 bolts: 4.44oz???
CC 85A HV ESC: 4.2ozs
Turnigy 20 X 12 electric wood prop 3ozs?
4.72" diameter (120mm x 103mm) 3 blade spinner: 7oz
10S Zippy 5800mAh(25/35C) (46oz ea)
Airtronics 2.4 Ghz 8ch Receiver: .46oz
1 HS-5625MG servo: 2ozs (for elevator)
1 HS-5625MG servo: 2ozs (for rudder)
4 HS-5485HB servos (1.6oz each): 6.4ozs (2 for flaps and 2 for ailerons)
Turnigy UBec: 1.5ozs
LADO Electric Retracts/LADO Struts/Hobby King 4" wheels: 15.5ozs
Electric tail retract/Strut/1¾" wheel: 2ozs
Misc (glue, servo extensions, pushrods and servo screws etc): 8ozs???
Pilot, cockpit and cannons: 8ozs???
TOTAL COMPONENT WEIGHT = 154.5oz??? OR 9lbs 10.5ozs???
TOTAL KIT WEIGHT = 115.65ozs???
TOTAL ALL UP = (270.15ozs OR 16lbs 14ozs AUW???)
The only thing left to do to confirm this decision is to do a mock up of the plane and see if I can get the CG with the now lighter pack since this bird needs a LOT of weight up front to balance.
Colin
April 15, 2012, 11:13:16 pm »
So I made some home made gromets/washers. (http://emfso.org/smf/Smileys/classic/grin.gif) Got an old inner tube (bicycle) and used my sharpened brass tool that I use to "drill" holes in foam to cut them out. After you've cut them out, the key is to get your "starter" hole in dead center (second pic) so that when you screw your screw into it, it'll be nice and even.
Incidentally to get them tight up under my screw head I just screwed the screw with the gromet on the end into a piece of wood (in this case a popcicle stick (http://emfso.org/smf/Smileys/classic/wink.gif) ) and that "screws" the gromet/washer neatly on. (Fifth pic shows when I back the screw out how even and flush the gromet is on the screw)
I know all this is probably of no value to the grizzled veterans out there but I thought it was kinda neat how they came out so for those less experienced I thought I'd share. (http://emfso.org/smf/Smileys/classic/grin.gif)
Colin
April 15, 2012, 11:33:13 pm »
So I'm finally about to bolt my motor on to this bird and thought I'd share a pic before I do so. All accounts indicate that she'll need A LOT of weight up front to balance. Some have been adding a pound or two of lead in addition to putting their 40ozs+ worth of batteries in the cowl!!! I'm baseing all of this on the old KMP Typhoon which I'm 99.99999% positive this was cloned after since all measurements, airfoil and weights etc are exactly the same.
In any event, I prefer to add usefull weight and that's why I got this BEAST of a motor. (http://emfso.org/smf/Smileys/classic/wink.gif) (http://emfso.org/smf/Smileys/classic/grin.gif) In terms of power it's COMPLETE OVERKILL for this plane, (since it can do up to 7000 watts and this plane will only be propped for 2,500 watts or so) but its weight should do quite nicely. (http://emfso.org/smf/Smileys/classic/grin.gif) To mount it I'll need to use a secondary backplate "base" in addition to the backplate mount it came with. Together all the stuff you see in the pic come up to a whopping 59 ounces! This together with the 7 ounce spinner and 2.5 ounce prop should ensure that I don't have to put my batts in the cowl which I'm loathe to do. (http://emfso.org/smf/Smileys/classic/wink.gif)
Colin
60oz... I looked around at my planes and it took four of the ones in view with there batteries to get to 60oz! That is just the motor! My heaviest plane totals just 100oz. I'm such a light weight. You need to adopt the beer bottle for scale approach for pictures like that one Colin! « Last Edit: April 16, 2012, 07:40:21 am by ededge2002 »
April 16, 2012, 09:34:32 am »
Don't worry, the motor ALONE is only 48 ozs! Here's the comparison. (I don't drink beer. (http://emfso.org/smf/Smileys/classic/wink.gif) (http://emfso.org/smf/Smileys/classic/smiley.gif) )
Colin
June 07, 2012, 11:33:04 pm »
Darn time flys! Well, yesterday I finally got my batteries and props for this bird so I have no excuse now but to get her done! My goal now is to have her maidened first and THEN finished (all the final details) by the Kingston Funfly. Ambitious I know but hey ... I'll give it my best shot!
Incidentally the second pic also shows my "dummy" pack based on the online specs so that I could dry fit them before ordering. The actual packs are gonna be in the 10S 8000mah configuration and weigh in at a mere 73 ounces. (http://emfso.org/smf/Smileys/classic/shocked.gif)
Colin
June 08, 2012, 02:42:01 pm »
Quote from: piker on June 08, 2012, 10:14:42 am (http://emfso.org/smf/index.php?topic=2951.msg14488#msg14488)
Colin,
Are all those packs going in at one time?
Robert
Lord no! I need a LOT of nose weight but 146 ounces would be a bit much! (http://emfso.org/smf/Smileys/classic/wink.gif) Yeah those are four 5S 8000mah packs you're seeing ... so it'll make two 10S 8000mah packs. Each 5S pack weighs four times the weight of my little P-40 that I'm building right now. (http://emfso.org/smf/Smileys/classic/shocked.gif) Gosh darn the wing loading of this thing will be frightening. (http://emfso.org/smf/Smileys/classic/shocked.gif) But no matter I'm now shooting for 19lbs all up which is about right apparently for this clone of a KMP Typhoon. (http://emfso.org/smf/Smileys/classic/grin.gif) Some have even come in at about 20lbs and still reported that it flys well at that weight so we'll see. Unfortunately I've never been know to make a "light" plane and apparently I'm not gonna buck that trend now. ::)
Colin
June 18, 2012, 08:51:22 pm »
Ok, I'm back at it ... the pic attached is the actual historical plane that I'm trying to replicate. It's a late production model Mk1B from No. 183 squadron. These were the versions with which they introduced the "bubble" canopy. (changed from the "car door" canopy from earlier production models)
The only difference beween mine and this one is that Im gonna be painting my tail band and spinner in the same yellow as the strips on the leading edge of the wing ... Yes it's not scale but I like the yellow. The mint green of the original is a little too "blah" for me since the entre color scheme is kinda drab anyway. This is my little attempt at creative liberty is order to add a wee bit of color to my plane. (http://emfso.org/smf/Smileys/classic/smiley.gif)
Colin
June 19, 2012, 09:47:32 am »Quote Colin, Will it be ready for Kingston??? I still see a lot of pics of unassembled parts. I'm hoping to see it
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June 19, 2012, 10:02:25 am »Quote I too hope to see it in Kingston. The Kingston RC Club is a great place to fly planes like that. But "no pressure"
I'm sure you're doing a fantastic job on it. But, as Andre said, we still haven't seen the plane itself. Even when I've been to your place you always seem to have it hidden away. Maybe it doesn't really exist!
Robert
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ededge2002
Sr. Member
Posts: 426
Re: 1/6.78 Scale Hawker Typhoon
« Reply #73 on: June 19, 2012, 11:29:12 am »Quote Quote " we still haven't seen the plane itself. Even when I've been to your place you always seem to have it hidden away. Maybe it doesn't really exist! "
Possibly he is pulling our legs? April 1st was months ago. I'm going to need some help kicking his ass! Who's in?
Member#2003
Formosa Racing #666
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#NOW AVAILABLE AT: http://temac.ca/smf/ (http://temac.ca/smf/)#
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piker
Hero Member
Posts: 1443
Re: 1/6.78 Scale Hawker Typhoon
« Reply #74 on: June 19, 2012, 11:34:40 am »Quote You hold him down and I'll kick his ass then run away
Unless, of course, he actually produces a 1:6.78 (very specific) Hawker Typhoon.
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June 19, 2012, 01:45:52 pm »
Yes, it exists ... I sent two hours in between clients yesterday sanding so it's here all right. (http://emfso.org/smf/Smileys/classic/grin.gif) Trust me this thing is taking so long I want to kick my OWN ass! :( ::) Believe it or not I set a definite date last night for the maiden. Thursday the 28th June ... DURING THE DAY. Hee hee! No pressure from spectators needed. lol. Off to do some airbrushing now ... I have another two hours before my next client. Maybe if you guys behave yourselves I'll post some pics of the plane all painted and mocked up later. (http://emfso.org/smf/Smileys/classic/wink.gif)
Colin
June 22, 2012, 10:59:46 pm »
Well there's good news and there's bad news ...
The good news is the Typhoon is starting to come together ... and the bad news is that because this MUST fly before Kingston, I have to pass on the Float Fly tomorrow because I need every minute I can get to work on this thing. I've decided that I just have to get it "flyable" so that the maiden gets done next week. I've wasted far too much time pondering on the details (all the fancy stuff that I want to do on this) and a lot of that kinda stuff calls for a LOT of time and brainpower, both of which are in short supply these days!
I just need to fly this thing ... and then I can do all the fancy stuff after. (Landing and navigation lights, sliding canopy, detailed cockpit, supplementary retractible gear doors, detailing and weathering etc, etc, etc) I know after seeing the pics I'm goinna post later tomight that it might look like it shouldn't take a lot of more time to get her into flyable condition, but with my time schedule (and young daughter) its gonna be tough. Anyways staying home tomorrow should give me a solid five hours on it which "should" put me closer to being on track for the maiden later in the week.
I still have to figure out and fabricate the battery location and battery compartment situation ... I still have to put in all the servos, linkages, pin all control surfaces, etc, etc, etc. Basically as I type this its an arf. At least i've got most of the painting done ... just have to basically do the registration numbers etc.
To give you an idea as to how the simplest of things can take so much time ... I masked and painted the canopy today ... it took about an hour and a half JUST TO MASK IT. (http://emfso.org/smf/Smileys/classic/shocked.gif) However I'm sooo glad I took my time cause it came out beautiful in the end. Really sharp lines etc. See for yourself ..
BTW, you'll notice a black line/mark in the first pic and on the base of the far side of the canopy in pic #4 ... it's not a crack but a mark I made on the inside to tell me where to make the transition between the green and the grey in the camo scheme. (http://emfso.org/smf/Smileys/classic/grin.gif) You can see the actual color transition in the next pic.
Colin
P.P.S Pics of the plane all put together (loosely assempled with tape etc) to come ...
June 23, 2012, 12:35:12 am »
Well here she is! This paint job was such a learning curve for me ... airbrushing and all that stuff is totally new to me but I find that the camo scheme is very forgiving ... since you can "smudge" and it looks intentional! (http://emfso.org/smf/Smileys/classic/wink.gif) I'm actually quite pleased with how it came out ... a lot of the transitions I got right ... some not so right ... the wings and tail feathers etc came out awesome in this regard ... the fuse not so much. Maybe it was by the time I got to the wings etc I had some practice.
In any event ... oh and by the way Rob, the reason you never saw it when you had come by was it was out to a friends because I had asked him to paint it (he owns a body shop) but he was never able to get around to it so I took it back. The first pic shows the base colors. (good ole latex from Home depot believe it or not!)
Colin
June 24, 2012, 05:41:49 pm »
Quote from: ededge2002 on June 24, 2012, 02:05:40 pm (http://emfso.org/smf/index.php?topic=2951.msg14623#msg14623)
For reference how big is that prop? Looks great but hard to get size from the photo. I'm going to loan you a beer bottle to use for scaling your photos.
21X12 ... However I may be using a 22x13 if I need the extra weight (2 ounces more) and if the amp draw is within my limits.
Colin
Well, after much deliberation I've decided to get this to the "flyable" stage ... get the maiden done and THEN do all the scale stuff that I originally planned. This way we'll see if she even flys first... time is such a prescious comodity for me these days that I'd hate to put in all that extra time and effort prematurely. This coupled with the fact that there are FOUR other planes that have to be done in time for the season start is a good reason for my decision.
Anyways finally did some work on her today ... after taking about 15 minutes just to get back up to speed on where I left off! ;D Have to set up my control surfaces so decided to start with the elevator. This has split elevators and typically what I'd do in this circumstance would be to use dual servos (typically in the tail) and then use a servo equalizer to balance them up.
However in this case I'm gonna go old school and use one servo situated in the somewhat traditional spot (mid to front fuse) since I need all the weight I can get up front. I'm just gonna use a "Split" control rod (or in this case Sullivan Gold N' Rods) for the hook up. Normally I would use a metal one (top in first pic) but there was some binding so decided to go with the Sullivans. Just had to join them at one end (I used some light gauge wire) and we were good to go.
Apologies for not having something more "exciting" to post! lol! ;D
Colin
Progress is progress. Even a little bit of work, here and there, moves the project forward. No work = no progress = no plane for the Spring :)
I know ... just doing that little bit got my juices flowing again. ;D I must admit that I'd left off this plane for so long that I was actually considering starting the other projects before restarting this one. Now my enthusiasm for this is back and I'm raring to get it done. (to the flyable stage anyway!)
Got a few hours free this afternoon and I intend to button up the rudder and tailwheel setups and get that all done. Can't wait to see how my tailwheel works when its all coupled up. ;D Then it's "just" to get my battery positioning and subsequent fabrication of battery box set up and she'll be "flyable".
Colin
Can't wait to see it Colin. It'll be awesome.
S
Don't forget the ski's!
Go Colin!!
Thanks Simon, Gordon, Rob! To be honest one of my motivations to get this done, is because I intend to start my first EVER balsa kit build! Woot woot! I'm fortunate to have one of the best for guidance, (Rob) because in his words "I don't want to see you mess this up"! ;D
It's be a CL-415 kinda off the same class/size as Rob's CL-215. I was mainly encouraged to start "real building" (finally) by Rob's persistent nagging over the years ... but also because of all the building craze that's going on at TEMAC nowadays. Seems like everywhere I turn on the site there's a balsa build going on. So I can't wait for this challenge ... should be a blast!
Colin
P.S There will be no skis on this one, Rob. ;)
Well, I've finally tied up the rudder, elevators and tailwheel mechanism. Not much to show for it except that it was a lot of fiddley stuff. Both rudder and tailwheel are hooked up via separate pull pull wires and I had to do some creative work with the servo arms as there might have been some "interferrance"between the wires. Again ... not a big deal but mostly fiddley stuff.
Glad to report that my tailwheel works perfectly with the hookup ... there was some concern that in the retracted position there might have been some issues with wire tangles but all came out quite well.
Alls left now is to sort out the battery positioning and susequent fabrication of the battery "compartment" but I daresay that this might be the most challenging of the build just by virtue of the fact that these are enormous packs! (10S 8000mah weighing almost five pounds!) So finding the right spot will take some carefull consideration and there will be no room for error with the fabrication once the cutting starts.
Colin.
P.S. Attached are some pics of the installed spilt elevator control rods, "double decker" rudder servo horns and tailwheel hookup. Again ... nothing special. ;)
Hey Colin,
Nice work. I really like the double decker servo arm. That way you can adjust the centers indiuvidualy, and also individualy adjust throw (by moving the clevises inward on the arm) if you find that, for example, you want less travel on the tail wheel. But what are the short pieces of nyrod for? Will the pull/pull linkages not thread directly into the clevis?
Robert
Quote from: piker on January 17, 2013, 09:29:21 AM
Hey Colin,
Nice work. I really like the double decker servo arm. That way you can adjust the centers indiuvidualy, and also individualy adjust throw (by moving the clevises inward on the arm) if you find that, for example, you want less travel on the tail wheel.
Exactly. I deliberately wanted the the adjustability of the tailwheel independent of the rudder adjustability even though they use the same servo.
Quote from: piker on January 17, 2013, 09:29:21 AM
what are the short pieces of nyrod for? Will the pull/pull linkages not thread directly into the clevis?
Robert
Nope! The linkages are from the kit's hardware and the clevises are sullivan's. Different fit ... so I adapted to the situation by using extra Gold N' Rod inner pieces (yellow) which add even more felxibility in terms of being adjustable. ;)
Well it took me almost five days to get the retracts (mains) just right. Talk about a PITA ... lots of reinforcing since this beast I'm predicting will be just shy of 20lbs! :o Then there was all the adjusting etc to get the rake of the mains and the tracking/alignment of the wheels just right ... and finally the endless tweaking to get the gear covers to fit perfectly. Next up is installation of landing/navigation lights.
Colin
http://youtu.be/Sg59efansGY (http://youtu.be/Sg59efansGY)
Wow! Those really fit nice and flush.
Thanks Michael ... took a lot of time to get it like that but it was worth it in the end! BTW your Bronco was awesome ... always liked a Bronco.
Colin
Yes! Awesome looking retracts, Colin. I hope they stay so nicely aligned after regular use.
I just hope they get "regular use". lol!
Ok so where were we ... oh yes installation of landing and nav lights. Before I get to that let me just say that its not been a good couple of weeks ...
SETBACK #1!
After getting my retracts all dialed in I discovered that the cheap HK electric retract (cost all of six bucks) that I was using for my tailwheel just stopped working! Turns out it couldn't take the "pressure" off all that cycling that I was doing in getting it and the main retracts dialled in just right. God forbid it should last for more than forty or fifty cycles without any weight on it at all!!
I don't know what I was thinking ... I put Lado retracts for my mains and then use a HK retract for the tailwheel! Penny wise and pound foolish ... or another way of putting it ... buy cheap buy twice! (or thrice! lol!) So waiting for the replacements for that. Incidentally, depending on how you look at it ... everything happens for the best cause in pulling out the cheapie retract discovered that my fabrication of the tailwheel setup wasn't as robust as I'd have liked. (See post 19 here (http://temac.ca/smf/index.php/topic,3383.msg17998.html#msg17998)) I now have a new plan of fabrication in my head for when the new retract arrives. Instead of the tailwheel assemply and its shaft/strut rotating within the retract, the tailwheel assemply will now rotate on the shaft/strut. You'll see when I show pics ... it'll be cool. I'm pretty excited about it causse it'll be rock solid!
SETBACK #2!
Ok .. now on to the lights. Well, I got most of ti done and wouldn't you know ... as I got it all done and started working on the lens ... dicovered that there wa s short in the circuit somewhere! So now I have to rip em all out and locate the short and put it all back together! Don't ya just love this hobby? >:( :)
Pics to come to show landing/nav lights setup.
Colin
I have some led fixtures/lenses from a construction road sigh we scrapped at work. I saved a bunch as they would be ideal for this use. I will post a picture tomorrow and if you want some just let me know.
Keep up the work Colin its been a long battle but you will reign in the end.
Thanks Ed, I appreciate that.
Colin
P.S. Yeah those led fixtures/lenses might come in handy the way I'm botching up this build of late. ;)
I took a few pictures to show the reflectors. If they are what you need let me know. I used a couple of amber LED's to show the pattern that they produce as the sigh was full of them. they are 17mm dia and 12mm tall. I used a bench grinder to square off one side and it had little effect on the light produced. I have about a hundred of them so if anyone else wants a few i could bring them out to the field or next meeting. The photos with the led on were taken at a much reduced voltage as it upset the camera.
Damn ... that's exactly waht I was looking for! I eventually had to buy a couple of Maglites just to get the lenses and them suckers are not cheap. >:( :'( Anyway I've already installed mine but I'd love to snag a couple of those of you if you don't mind for future projects! I've got a feeling that I'll be running lights in a lot of my projects going forwrd ... they just look too cool.
One of the things I really like about yours is unlike the ones from the Maglites they're obviously extremely strong if you could grind them down with your grinder! ;D
Colin
mine are solid plastic. the shine of the back of the plastic becomes the reflector! They are from one of those traffic signs you see blinking for hours on end in constructions zones. This one was hit by a truck and totaled so I scavenged a couple of fixtures but there were THOUSANDS of led's lol. Your more than welcome to some and anyone lese that would like some as well! I plan on one day doing a night flyer and these would be ideal!!
As promised here are some pics of my landing lights install for this bird.
Colin
Progress is being made ... albeit painfully slowly. >:( Here are my nav lights all installed along with lens. Yes I know they're not quite scale in terms of shape or positioning (as in the full size in last pic) but they're not done yet! ;) I promise you they'll be perfect before they're really done. :)
Some pictures attached of my homemade vacum bagging system to make the lens. This "system" consists of a heat gun held in a bench vise and a form glued to a stick. ;D Mix in some oven mitts, blend in some vice grips so I could hold and pull the plastic and you end up with a pair of great looking lens. (IMHO of course)
Ok, enough of lights ... onto the cannons! ;D
Colin
Nice work! Keep moving ahead... I'm trying to do the same...
Well the cannons are proving to be straightforward yet a bit tricky! ;) Since they are relatively large (7.5 inches of protrudence forward of leading edge) I decided to make them utilize a "break away" attachment method. The last thing I want is to have them snag in some situation (nose over etc) and rip my wing to bits at their attachment points! >:( That would surely suck.
So what I decided to do was use rare earth magnets to secure them to the wings. However they had to be "seated" somewhat so that they would have a solid attachment as opposed to just being "stuck on" to the wing. So I made some PVC attachment "bases" for them to sit in. These bases have about a quarter of an inch of a "lip" which is just enough to hold them a little more securely than if they were just stuck to magnets ... but yet not too secure to prevent them from "breaking away". I hope the pics make this a little clearer. ;D
Pic #1: These are the materials to make the cannons ... really just some plastic piping that I "hoarded" from some project around the house. (I think?)
Pic #2: One of the magnets and its base.
Pic #3: The magnet seated into its base.
Pic #4: The magnet/base seated and glued into the cannons' PVC base, which in turn will be glued into the wing itself. (The distance between the magnet and the edge of the PVC piping is what i was referring earlier to as the "lip". )
Pic #5: Plastic cannon with its magnet base glued in. This will mate to the PVC wing base.
Pic #6: Three done! Main body of cannon made up from a hardwood dowel. These were hand turned (my kingdom for tools ... lathe, band saw, scroll saw etc etc etc!) These were a PITA to get done ... tried my best to get them true.
Stay tuned ... there's a lot more to these cannons ... seemed simple at first ... but is anything really simple in this hobby? Next up is attaching their "tips", filling, priming and painting them and the final install. (Not looking forward to allignment and spacing issues with their final install!)
Colin
P.S It just occurred to me that I might be boring you guys to death with all this "detail" ... I know some would say that I never really showed how I actually built/put the plane together but to me that's boring cause its somewhat routine with this type of kit. ;D If I had to sheet and glass the plane etc (the guy had already done that) or if it were a balsa build that would be interesting. However the sanding, attaching parts, painting etc in this case was pretty straigforward and as such not worth posting IMHO.
In this kind of a kit I believe the devil is in the details as they say ... so I think the interesting parts are when builders show how they figure out issues/challenges in a build and come up with/fabricate solutions. But that's just me ... so let me know if there are too much details is this case. ;)
The devil IS in the details, and so is the interest ;D Those not interested can choose to skip over, but those of us who are passionate about building enjoy the detailed descriptions that you guys are providing.
Michael mentoned to me the other day that he feels people are most interested in the convertion details. Details like motor, esc, and battery selection and mouting. Although I feel he's correct in a lot of cases, I feel a lot of people are interested in the construction and detailing details as well. Afterall, once you know how to select a motor and bolt it to the front of a plane, you start to look toward other aspects of the hobby with interest.
keep up the great work, Colin!
Quote from: piker on February 22, 2013, 01:18:40 PM
Michael mentoned to me the other day that he feels people are most interested in the convertion details.
That may well be true cause sometimes I feel as if its only you and a few other die hards are looking at this one! ;) Anyway I love details trivial or otherwise so I'm just gonna soldier on! ;D On that note got a little more stuff done today ... "turned" out some muzzle tips (used my Dremel jig in place of a lathe) and did some test fitting.
Colin.
P.S. Weird how the top and front shots seems to show the cannons splayed outwards which is not the case in reality. The left and right shots seem to show how it really is a little better.
Colin,
I'm sure there are more lurkers following your thread than you realize. For inexperienced (at building, not at lurking) lurkers like me, the knowledge and level of skill demonstrated by many of the experienced builders is intimidating...I don't have much to contribute at this level except applause! Keep up the posts! :)
add me to the list of lurkers... keep the the posts coming ;D
I appreciate that "lurkers"! ;D So I just found the clearest pic of the full sized cannons to date ... I knew there was more work to be done! ;)
Colin
Details take time. Lots of it!
No one saw me lurking here did they??
Guys, where can I get a piece of aluminum sheet about 1/4 inch thick or so? Actually I just need a piece about four inches square so I guess that would hardly qualify as a "sheet"! ;D
Thanks!
Colin
Take a roll of aluminum foil and start folding. ..
Actually I believe the places from this thread would be good sources.
http://temac.ca/smf/index.php/topic,3791.0.html (http://temac.ca/smf/index.php/topic,3791.0.html)
Progress has been suspended until I return from my trip to the RAF museum (http://www.rafmuseum.org.uk/london/)in the UK! ;D There lives the only surviving Typhoon so I'm leaving for a week this weekend. I suspect I'll be taking hundreds of photos of this plane. (and any others I think I may model in the future.) After this if I don't succeed in getting this plane "scale" ... it certainly won't be for the lack of documentation! ;)
Colin
Oh man! Can I come?????
Oh well, if not, you are officially on assignment for me... Here's what I need:
LOTS of pictures of the Supermarine Stranrear (my next winter's build that I NEED documentation for... not much on the internet). I want to do a nice, scale build, so I need lots of detail pictures like:
Top side, underside, and both side overall views and closeup views for details, panel lines, and markings
Cockpit details if possible, including seats, cabin left side and right side, ceiling, floor, back wall of cockpit, close up of instruments, etc. Even nice, straight on shots of the instruments so I can recreate them.
Control surface hinging and control details (ail, rudd, elev.)
Engine and nacelle details from all angles
Step and tip float shapes and details
Rib stitching details (and stitch to stitch measurement if possible)
Landing gear (beaching gear) details including front and side views (so I can get the stance correct)
Window/windscreen flashing details
Exterior door and hatches details
If there's documentation for sale (three views, stories, marking reference, etc.) please buy it for me... as long as you have room in your luggage.
Some pictures of the SE5a would be nice. Although not as necessary as the Stranraer, because there's quite a bit on the internet, it would be nice to have more pictures specificaly for modelling a specific airfraft. Primariliy, markings (top, bottom, both sides, front), and flying wire connection points to the wings.
And if you have time, it would be nice to have some pictures of the Sunderland... just because it's an awesome plane.
Oh, and the Supermarine Southampton too. Lots of pictures if you can :)
Thanks! ;D
Is that all you want? ;D I'll see what I can do! ;)
Colin.
Well, I figured since you're there ;D
The Stranraer is the priority. I think it's the only one in existance. I don't care too much about the others, but I NEED info on the Stranrear...
Well it appears that you're in luck ... just found out that there is one on display (http://www.rafmuseum.org.uk/research/collections/supermarine-stranraer/) in the "Historic Hangers" location. I guess I'll be heading over there if the Typoon doesn't take all the space on my memory card! ;)
Colin
Matter of fact I can even see it right here (http://www.rafmuseum.org.uk/london/things-to-see-and-do/virtual-tours/historic-hangars.aspx)!
I know! Why do you think I'm making such large demands? I think that's the only one in the world!
Thanks in advance ;)
Robert
Can you get me a Spitfire, preferably a Mk.9, but I'd settle for a Mk.5
Thanks! ;D
Well, I actually got to the stage where I did a preliminary test today to see where I would have to position my batteries to attain my CG and I have some good news. Seems like I'll be able to use the position I had originally cut out for the battery bay after all! ;D
Way back when ... I had purchased some 8000mah 5S packs (for their weight) and had cut out a battery bay based on their published size. Well whadya know ... when they came they were juuusssst too big for my bay. DRATS!!! So there was a LOT of head scratching and pondering to find a new spot for my bay. This baby need sooooo much weight up front to balance that it was rediculous.
Anyways ... based on my tests today it seems like I'll be able to get away with a 56oz pack (as opposed to the 75oz one that I'd ordered! Having said that ... I'll still need an additional 10ozs with the lighter pack to balance but that's still half a pound that I've saved AND I'll get to use my original battery bay! Yay!!
Colin
Man Colin that thing is a beast. 55oz batteries! Thank goodness you've got those big biceps!!
That's great, Colin. I know that was your greatest concern with the build. Now finishing it off will be easy ;D
Is there any ESC cooling? Lol
Well, I'm back and what an amazing place the RAF museum was! Got some shots like I'd hoped. First is the entrance ... second is me and a Hurricane in front of the buildings ... third is me in front of the Typhoon and the fourth is of my Uncle in law standing in front of a "Ferret" Armoured Personnel Carrier. (He's a retired Major in the british army and commanded a squadon of these at one point on his career so I thought it would be cool to take the shot.)
Colin
Nice photos.
That Typhoon is a big plane.
Yup! They sometimes called her "The Beast"! The pic says why. :o
Colin
Well I can't believe it but she's pretty much all wired up now! Got the power system wired up tonight (ESC, UBEC and shunt switch) so theroretically I can fire her up as we speak.
As I mentioned before I was able to go with the original hatch that I'd cut so long ago since I'm gonna go with smaller batteries. (10S 5800mah @ 56ozs as opposed to 10S 8000mah @75ozs!) Always scary to cut a hatch into a composit plane ... never mind twice! Let hope I never have a high speed nose in cause there're some serious "bits" at the business end of this beast. :o
Colin
Test flight this weekend?
How did the tail wheel work out? Photos?
We're awaaaaaays from a test flight. I have to be flying everything else before I'll trust my thumbs to this maiden. ;) I just want to get it done to flying stage so I can leave it off and get on with the damn queue! Tailwheel is coming ... still needs LOTS of filing and shaping though ... again ... I'm trying to work on a lot of projects at once ... not my strong suit. :(
Colin
Your power system photos show a model that's deserving of the Beast title too! Spectacular!
That's some serious right thrust, She looks wonderful, you will have to let me know when the maiden is planned so I can put it in a tickler! Maybe even sell tickets for the Field Maintenance Fund. You should be very pleased with your self this has been quite the slog.
Jack.
Thanks Bill!
Quote from: Papa on March 27, 2013, 05:54:01 PM
That's some serious right thrust, She looks wonderful, you will have to let me know when the maiden is planned so I can put it in a tickler! Maybe even sell tickets for the Field Maintenance Fund. You should be very pleased with your self this has been quite the slog.
Jack.
Nah there's actually not a lot of right thrust ... it's an optical illusion because of the camera angle. I'm actually thinking I may need
more right thrust because of the gigantic prop and it corresponding torque forces ... but I'll wait for taxi tests to make that call. If it pulls too much to the left on my mock runouts I'll adjust it.
As for the maiden ... as I mentioned before that's a looong ways off since I tend to get rusty thumbs when i haven't flown for a long time (ie: over winter) and I won't trust myself with this until I get back into the groove. Besides ... it'll be done alone (less pressure and nerves) with no fanfare, so you'll have to settle for getting a success or failure report
after the fact for the Tickler! ;)
Colin
Ok now we come to the second more scary part of this build for me ... the cutting of the cowl! :o How's the saying go? Measure twice and cut once? Well I've been know to measure a million times and still cut wrong, so fingers crossed. ;)
This cut is gonna be the actual hatch ... and its supposed to match the opening (battery bay) in the fuse itself. (cut much earlier) Normally I just use the piece that I cut out as the hatch itself, but unless you cut it with a a razor thin blade and perfectly straight you always end up with a raggedy hatch because of a somewhat imperfect cut.
The lines aren't clean enough so that when you reinstall it again as a hatch there are some small imperfections/gaps in the borders. I want this be be a perfectly snug fit so you'll notice from the pics that I actually am in the process of making a FG hatch in the likely case that I botch the cut as I've described above.
Typically, to make a perfect cut I would use a steel edge as a guide and then score the material with a sharp blade (eg: razor blade or #11 hobby blade) enough times so that eventially when I do cut through its an extremely thin and clean, precise cut.
However THIS cowl is about three layers of thick (5 to 7oz?) FG so it would be almost impossible to cut it with my scoring method ... and the curve of the cowl is such that I wouldn't be able to use my steel edge "guide" since it can't flex for that much of a curve.
So ... I'm just gonna dremel cut it with a cut off wheel which will probably make a cut with a corresponding 1/16" of a gap. However I'll then just cut and sand my replacement hatch to perfectly fit the hole I've made.
That's the plan anyways! ;D ;) Working on that this morning so should have some news as to how it all turned out today sometime. Stay tuned!
Colin
Here's a pic of the right thrust Jack ... I'm really thinking I need more now that I see this with the laser!
Colin
Ok ... I'm done ... let me just say this. This worked out better than I could ever have hoped for. I'ts amazing what you can do if you have PATIENCE! ;D Anyways, I'll list it pic by pic with descriptions to go with each one explaining the process.
Pic #1: Held my breath, crossed my fingers and did the cut of the hatch ... came out really straight even though I free handed it with the Dremel. You can see the big gap I spoke of previously created by the thickness of the dremel cutoff wheel. Still ... I had made provision for that with my FG hatch that I fabricated so I'm VERY pleased. :)
Pic #2: Shows the actual cutout with the edges cleaned up.
Pic #3: YES!! It fit perfectly over my battery bay. My million times measuring this paid off for once! ;D (At this stage the edges weren't cleaned up yet)
Pic #4: FG hatch released and cleaned up prior to final fitting and trimming. Shown here next to the piece I cut out. I used three layers of 5oz cloth and it came out exactly the same thickness as the rest of the canopy! Whoo hoo! ;D
Pic #5: FG hatch overlaid and taped over cutout so I can mark the exact cut lines from the inside of the cowl. (I used an extremely sharp pencil to get the thinnest line possible)
Pic #6: The finished product! This is the result of me cutting juuuuuuusssst outside my cut lines and then sanding and fitting about fifity or sixty times to get it just so. That's what I meant about the patience bit. lol!) BTW, what you see is it sitting inside the cutout, not resting on the canopy. ;)
I am esctatic ... you gotta love it when a plan comes together! ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D
Colin.
Very nice! Did you leave room for a flange?
It'll be on the underside.
That is extremely neat, well done!
Jack.
Thanks Jack. Finally got some time to get back to the plane today ... finished up the hatch support and attachment issues ... decided to go with rare earth magnets for a clean attachment.
With the supporting frame attached it distrorted the hatch itself a teeny bit so the fit is not as precise as before but its good enough that when painted people won't even be able to tell where the hatch is.
Still haven't decided what to use "grip" it for removal ... using this screw for now until I decide.
Colin
How about a suction cup from a kids arrow? Dollarama!
Could you dummy an oil filler cap?
Put a bigger magnet underneath and use the head of a nail to lift the hatch. Invisible!
Jack.
Quote from: Papa on April 01, 2013, 08:56:39 PM
How about a suction cup from a kids arrow? Dollarama!
Put a bigger magnet underneath and use the head of a nail to lift the hatch. Invisible!
Jack.
Hmmm ... VERY interesting and unique suggestions! I don't think I would ever have thought of those. I especially see promise in the second one. ;D Will test it just now and report back ... thanks!
Colin
The magnet version shows some promise. ;) BTW, was just going through some of my UK photos and realised that my ehaust stacks are not nearly as scale as the full size. The real typhoon (see first pic) has rather flattened stacks compared to mine so I made some "adjustments" and am pleased as to how it came out.
Colin
p.s. Second and third pics are of how I had the stacks originally and the rest depict my "adjustments".
See? That's the problem. In order to do some nice details, you gather more scale information. With more scale information you see the proper way to do the details, and you see other details you'd like to add. Before you know it, you're adding more and more "stuff" that simply cant be left off! Ugh!
But it's fun and rewarding. The only challenge is time. I so wish it was still the middle of winter!!!
O.K., not really ;)
Robert
Quote from: piker on April 03, 2013, 10:19:47 AM
See? That's the problem. In order to do some nice details, you gather more scale information. With more scale information you see the proper way to do the details, and you see other details you'd like to add.
Well, I've heard more than once that with a scale project you're never
really done. >:( ;D The thing that's a little frustrating is that its causing me to do over a lot of the work that I've already done. (cannons, tailwheel, these stacks etc etc etc!) This is causing me to get bogged down in the details.
I've just adjusted my pre maiden list of things that have yet to be completed and they're up to 17! Granted a lot of these are little things but experience has taught me that these are the things that can take the most time. BTW, the post maiden list of things to do is just 5 ... but one of that five is weathering. ;)
Ok, off to do the next on the list ... the radiator!
Colin
Ok ... pic one is what we're looking to replicate. :)
Pic two are my assembled "materials" with which to do so. Some plastic mesh from Michael's crafts, some light ply, a foam cup and a Pepto Bismol dispenser! ;)
Let the crude bashing begin! ;D
Colin
Love the innovation! Way to go Colin.
Ok here we go ... ready for paint!
Pic #1: Grill cut out and glued onto my base ring.
Pic #2: Hole cut out for my cup "lip". ;)
Pic #3: Test fit. Starting to take shape!
Pic #4: Notice the black spots on the left half of the grill? These are use ed to mark where I have to cut. (The right half is already done) This is my way of trying to better simulate the vertical "fins" of the rad.
Pic #5: All complete except for paint.
Pic #6: Compared to the grill that came with the kit.
Pic #7: Test install! I'm pretty pleased with the outcome cause I know it'll look even sharper when painted!
Colin
All I can say is what were they thinking with that supplied piece.
Yours is way better and much more realistic.
jack.
Nice work. The genius of the finished product is in your materials list.
Thanks guys. Took advantage of the weather today and did some paintwork ... pics tomorrow.
Colin
Can't wait for the pics.......and I'm sure seeing it "in the flesh" will be even more awe-inspiring.
Ok painted and installed. Pretty pleased! ;D
Colin
Hmmm ... now that I look at it against the full size the bevelled edges of my "circles" and the shinyness of my paint make it look too "plasticy". Hmmm ... I might have to fix that .... OR ... am I being too anal retentive? Hmmm ...
Colin
Get a little dust on it and it will be perfect. Yours is just new not some old piece of junk sitting in a museum lol
Think I'm gonna take the path of least resistance and just hit it with some flat clear ... between the hatch, the exhaust stacks and now this radiator, I've never spent this much time on a cowl on my life!
Colin
Your rad is truly rad and looks better than the one in the museum! Hope I get to see it fly...Warbirds Day?...little more than a month away! :o
Thanks Bill! Don't want to make any more promises as to completion date. (did that too many times already! lol!) but I will say this ... no matter what stage she's at by the time the TEMAC warbird day rolls around, I'll bring her out there. ;)
Colin
Hit the rad with some matte clear ... looks better now and it'll have to do. (First and third pics are before the matte "treatment") Hatch sanded and primed but can't say I like how the fit turned out though ... will need more work to get that seamless fit I'm looking for.
Colin
You worry too much, no one is ever going to be that close.
It looks super compared to the bought one.
jack.
Quote from: Papa on April 07, 2013, 09:06:36 PM
You worry too much, no one is ever going to be that close.
It's not about anyone else noticing, Jack, it's that OCD thing that's been suggested that I have. ;D (mild? ;) )
Colin
I'll be looking that close. ;D
Robert
Mild OCD??
Despite the irrational behaviour, OCD is sometimes associated with above-average intelligence.
Its sufferers commonly share personality traits such as
high attention to detail,
avoidance of risk,
careful planning,
exaggerated sense of responsibility and a
tendency to take time in making decisions.
What's wrong with that? I think I could do with some OCD, I might build better models.
Jack.
Quote from: Papa on April 08, 2013, 03:32:13 PM
Mild OCD??
Despite the irrational behaviour, OCD is sometimes associated with above-average intelligence.
Its sufferers commonly share personality traits such as
high attention to detail,
avoidance of risk,
careful planning,
exaggerated sense of responsibility and a
tendency to take time in making decisions.
Crap! After reading that list I think I have FULL OCD!
Colin
What's wrong with that? I think I could do with some OCD, I might build better models.
Jack.
You just like the "above-average intelligence" comment.
Nah its the "tendency to take (TOO MUCH) time in making decisions" one that sealed it for me! ;D
Colin.
Ok time to get the wing wiring etc all wrapped up. There are quite bit of connections involved here with this plane. I'm using all ten of my channels and there's also a "Y" in there somewhere (since I really needed 11) Here are my channel assignments:
Two channels for flaps
Two for ailerons
One for rudder
One for elevator
One for main landing gear retracts
One for tailwheel retract
One for nav lights (A1)
One for my Ubec (A2)
One for my throttle
So I've decided to make things simpler by using a couple of Multiplex connectors for the wing connections. With these you can connect up to four leads per connector and since the wing is where all the connecting and disconnecting takes place, not only will it make it less work, but it'll leave no room for error.
I'm sure we've all experienced connecting all our wires ... putting on the wing ... only then to discover that we've connected the aileron servos to the flaps channel, or some other such thing. >:( (or is it just me? ;) ) This way ... just two connectors to connect and I'm done! ;D
Not looking forward to all the soldering though ... quite tricky to do a neat job cause the pins on the connector are somewhat close together. The second pic is of one I'd done for one of my hotliners.
My landing lights hook up directly to a 9V source so at least I don't need a channel for that ... however I have to function some sort of mechanical switch hooked up to the gear so that when the gear is down the lights are on. I have an idea as to what I'll do ... its just a asquestion of trying it out to see if it will work.
Colin
Why don't you use a remote receiver switch for the landing gear and connect it with a Y to the landing gear somewhat similar to this one:
http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/store/__31775__Turnigy_Receiver_Controlled_Switch_UK_Warehouse_.html (http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/store/__31775__Turnigy_Receiver_Controlled_Switch_UK_Warehouse_.html)
On another note I guess you are using two channels for the flaps in order to easily reverse one of the servos. You can reduce one channel by using a servo reverser on one of the flaps servo.
Bobby
Hey Bobby,
I've had mixed reviews on that switch so I decided to try my low tech solution first. ;) As for the flaps using two channels ... I wanted the ability to trim/setup each flap independently because of the somewhat unique and peculiar nature of the travel of the flaps on this plane. Thanks for the input though ... every suggestion I get can help me along the way!
Colin
Quote from: Bobmic on April 10, 2013, 03:30:17 PM
Why don't you use a remote receiver switch for the landing gear and connect it with a Y to the landing gear somewhat similar to this one:
http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/store/__31775__Turnigy_Receiver_Controlled_Switch_UK_Warehouse_.html (http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/store/__31775__Turnigy_Receiver_Controlled_Switch_UK_Warehouse_.html)
Hey Bobby, I've been doing some more research on that switch you recommended and it sounds more and more like a viable option. Will definitely consider it if my low tech solution doesn't work out. Thanks again!
Colin
My switch works! Whoo hoo! lol! So I hooked everything up tonight and ran a test and it works perfectly. I really like the simplicity of the solution. It's just basically two connectors that close the circuit.
In addition to the simplicity of it (mechanical so less prone to failure) it also saves me a channel and provides some more of the needed weight up front. (9V battery stored under my battery hatch)
Pic #1: Part A of my "switch". This is glued to the strut of my retracts.
Pic #2: Part B of my "switch". This is glued in a corresponding position so that when the gear deploys it connects or "mates" with Part A to complete the circuit.
Pic #3: This shows the positioning of the two parts.
Pic #4: The 9V battery which powers this circuit and is housed neatly in the main battery hatch. This provides a cool extra benefit of providing an additional ounce and a half of weight forward of the CG. (I need every ounce I can get forward) This means I can reduce my "dead weight" to balance even further to about 7 ounces!
Videos being uploaded to YouTube as we speak ... stay tuned! :)
Colin
Here's the video. BTW, you'll see after the lights come on ... almost immediately they then go back off. That's obviously not supposed to happen. As long as the gear is deployed the lights should stay on. Turns out that I had a bad connector which has since been replaced so all is well!
Colin
http://youtu.be/qnnMl2D6qbg (http://youtu.be/qnnMl2D6qbg)
But what if on the landing checklist in the full scale your supposed to put the landing lights on before the gear is down? Hahahaha ! Just joking!
If the switch gives you troubles you could always use a brushed esc with the positive pulled in the connector.
I have no idea what Ed just explained, but awesome job, Colin.
Hey Colin! I like your videos and commentary ;D Nice simple idea too.
Oh, and I had to think about what Ed was saying too, then realized he was suggesting using a brushed ESC as an electrical switch.
Thanks guys! Trying to keep it simple Ed, and you don't get much simpler than this. ;)
Colin
Quote from: wollins on April 10, 2013, 02:17:28 PM
So I've decided to make things simpler by using a couple of Multiplex connectors for the wing connections. With these you can connect up to four leads per connector and since the wing is where all the connecting and disconnecting takes place, not only will it make it less work, but it'll leave no room for error.
Guys, are there any multi pin connectors out there that have more than the four servo capacity of the MPX (Multiplex clones) connectors? Since I need six connections via my wing, I'll need to use two of my
MPX ones (http://www.boomarc.com/en/mpx-connector-male-and-female-set) (capability of four connections each) so I'd love to find connectors that have more so that I can just do ONE connector for my wing. Basically I just need a six servo capable multi pin connector. This 8 pin example can be seen
here (http://www.alofthobbies.com/8-pin-wing-connector.html). Any suggestions where I might find something like this locally?
Thanks!
Colin
Why not solder them all together in "Y"'s to reduce the number of plugs?
1 for Ailerons, 1 for flaps and 1 for landing gear.
Jack.
Quote from: Papa on April 15, 2013, 11:57:53 AM
Why not solder them all together in "Y"'s to reduce the number of plugs?
1 for Ailerons, 1 for flaps and 1 for landing gear.
Jack.
Cause that negates that whole individual surface trimming thing that I like to do! ;) The 8 pin would be perfect. See pic. ;D
Colin
Quote from: wollins on April 13, 2013, 07:07:47 PM
Pic #2: Part B of my "switch". This is glued in a corresponding position so that when the gear deploys it connects or "mates" with Part A to complete the circuit.
Colin
QuoteTurns out that I had a bad connector which has since been replaced so all is well!
Quick update to that whole "bad connector" situation ... it was
not a "bad" connector. In reality the fabrication of the base on which Part B sat was ill conceived. ;) You'll notice that the connector sat on a piece of foam.
Well the whole concept was that I needed a base which had some "give" so that when the strut with Part A mated with Part B, it would collapse so as to not only get a better connection, but so it wouldn't trigger the over current protection feature of the retracts ... which would have caused it to not deploy to its end point ... which would then cause the gear to collapse on landing ... yada yada yada...
The concept was sound but the flaw in the design was the material used. ;) That foam
did have "give" but no resilience or "bounce back". So what happened was upon cycling a few times, it collapsed (as it should) but didn't bounce back upon retraction, thereby making an incomplete connection the next time (and thereafter) that I deployed.
So how did I fix it? I crept upstairs and snipped a piece of memory foam from my wife's side of the mattress and replaced the defective foam in Part B. Problem solved! YES! ;D ;D ;D ;D
KIDDING! ;D ;D The woman would kill me!!! ;D ;D
What I actually did was redesign Part B to now have a compression
spring to ensure "bounce back". Another thing that I did was I increased the surface area of part B by wrapping it with copper wire and then soldering and filing it. This will ensure an even better connection because as anyone who has worked with these connectors before would know ... they are not designed for the application that I'm using them for. (see the hole in the middle?) They're a screw down type connector.
BTW, the base beneath the connector now is a piece of the Hitec rubber/foam protector mat that used to come with their receivers that I had lying around. This was added to ensure that upon compression the connector and spring didn't bend/twist as it was being compressed. In other words it keeps it straight.
Ok enough talk ... pics and video will wrap this part of the build up ... FINALLY. hee hee!
Pic #1 ... Part B ... the original
Pic #2 ... Part B ... revised parts
Pic #3 ... Part B ... compression spring insert
Pic #4 ... Part B ... revised parts assembled
Colin.
P.S Can ya see why this has taken so long now? ;D
http://youtu.be/WV0gyjV4E7o (http://youtu.be/WV0gyjV4E7o)
Ok, all the is soldering is killing me! >:( Soon be done though. ;D Incidentally Ed had brought up a valid concern to me the other day. He was concerned that I'd be relying on one connector for all of these connections. Specifically he was concerned about a scenario where the LG might hang up thereby over amping my connections and/or browning out my receiver.
However I assured him that I thought I was pretty safe because of the following:
1. The BEC I'm using is rated for 10A/15A
2. The retracts have over current protection so as soon as they hang up they shut down ... provided no further draw on the system.
3. Supposedly ... the 8 pin connectors that I'm trying to source are rated for 15 amps per pin or a max of 60A per connector.
HOWEVER ... despite all that I have decided that I'll go with two connectors to "spread the load" just to be safe. So thanks ED! This is the reason that these forums are so valuable ... its always a good feeling to know that fellow modelers are always looking out for you and are willing to help out. I'm always trying to learn something every day. Sometimes you're so close to a build or project that you miss stuff that others may see as plain as day.
Colin
Wiring done! ;D
Colin
Very nice Colin.
The before and after photos tell it all.
Come on over tomorrow I've got more soldering to do.
Quote from: Ededge2002 on April 20, 2013, 01:56:40 AM
Come on over tomorrow I've got more soldering to do.
Good luck with that my friend, I don't want to see another soldering iron for awhile. ;D Just did a "test wiring" vid and everything's checked out so I'm now gonna put this Typhoon aside for a week or so cause it's now ....
NOONER TIME! ;D Finally I'll be opening my "bag o' bits". (see pic) Goal is to finish by month end. (Based on my track record I'm being ambitious but hey gotta aim for something right?
Colin.
http://youtu.be/VvMujZ35ZsY (http://youtu.be/VvMujZ35ZsY)
I was looking at this thread so I could stop looking at the ones I'm building ! So much for that.
I would recommend that you cover with low temp film. The ailerons are sheeted foam and warp easily.
Quote from: Ededge2002 on April 20, 2013, 02:39:32 PM
I was looking at this thread so I could stop looking at the ones I'm building !
No worries ... I'm not doing a build thread on the Nooner. I'll be back to this one in a week or so. ;)
Colin
Batteries have arrived (now 12S instead of 10S) so hopefully taxi tests can commence!
Colin
Ok, back to the Tiffie! So .. where were we? Oh yes ... taxi testing. Well, that didn't happen. With a three year old and a newborn, the priorities got a bit shifted. ;) Anyways, yesterday I figured let me give it a go once more, after all this has been about two years in the making?
So yesterday I decided to hook up my tailwheel (pull pull to rudder) and replace that dud retract unit that I discovered a week or so ago had just stopped working ... all by itself. >:(
I had bought a pair of these retract units (http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/store/uh_viewItem.asp?idproduct=24326)so I decided to pop in the other one ... did that and no sooner than I fired her up, after about three cycles this one died too! :o Well, after much head scratching and cussing, I figured something must be wrong with my system, I mean yes they're cheap but they should be good for quite a few cycles ... especially since they had not even touched the ground yet!
As this was happening the familiar smell of burnt electronics hit me ... then is when the "aha" moment dawned upon me. Checked the specs on this retract and yup ... voltage limit was 6V and I'm pretty sure my BEC is set at 7.2V.
Anyways, I decided that I couldn't be bothered to confirm the Bec's voltage setting since that would entail taking off the cowl etc, (a bi#$h to adjust and get just so) so I decided that I'd just hook up the tailwheel and run the plane without the retracting feature for now. Or at least after the maiden, THEN I'll get a proper retract unit for it.
Ok, so moving on. Took her out to the back yard to do some mini taxi tests and was quite pleased. Reason being is that TEMAC is like a golf green compared to the lawn in my backyard (ok so I exaggerate. ;) ) and it didn't show a ready tendency to tip over ... handled some pretty rough going pretty well. So ... I just have to take her out to TEMAC now to do some real testing and then who knows ... maybe this thing will actually fly in 2013?
Pics of here sitting on grass for the first time in the backyard to come!
Colin
Colin,
Glad you're back at it. I really can't wait to see this plane in the flesh.
Simon
Cool! Maybe we should maiden together (with my SE5a). Let's pick a calm evening when no one's around. ;D
That sounds perfect. ;D
I hope that "Nobody" whom ever they are has a camera and takes lots of pictures.
Jack.
The only reason to take pictures would be if one (or both) of the planes is written off. Otherwise, there will be plenty of opportunities for pictures at the TEMAC Fun Fly ;D
charging the camera now... when should i be there ;)
Well she's gonna feel TEMAC's grass under her wheels for the very first time tomorrow! YES! Gonna do some proper taxi testing. Got some pics of her in the backyard as promised and also did a run up of the motor ... lets just say that she's not lacking under the hood!
Colin
P.S Last pic is of the big 12S pack sitting snugly in their nest.
http://youtu.be/qhcyEA1TvgY (http://youtu.be/qhcyEA1TvgY)
Looks wonderful, Colin.
Hey "Nobody" get your camera ready you may see an OOPS Maiden tomorrow.
You know when fast taxing becomes low flying and the end of the runway is too near!
LOL
Jack.
Stupid weather today! Sorta threatened to rain all afternoon so I never even got to taxi the TIFFIE cause it takes a bit to set these big planes up and I wouldn't want to be caught trying to hustle to break it all down to beat the rain. (that's how you I break things ::) )
On second thoughts it was for the best cause in that atmosphere where there were many pilots at the field it wouldn't have been appropriate using the airfield while planes were in the air anyways. I'll just have to find a nice quiet time to "do ma bissness" ;D
Colin
And you KNOW they would have talked you into a test flight ;D
Well, the Tiffie has flown! Let me summarise this maiden flight report like this:
The take off was hairy scary ... the flight was beautiful ... the landing was terrible ...
which resulted in ... A CRASH!! :o
BUT ... no major damage done ... based on the initial cursory inspection.
So ... details.
Got to the field around 6.35pm to meet up with Rob ... (he was there for moral support) and it was a perfect day for a maiden. No one else there and the winds were calm. (so I can't blame the conditions! lol!) Anyway after a couple of warmup flights with the Nooner and then my big Decathlon, I figured now was a good a time as ever for giving her a go.
Did a few taxi circuits around the field to check that the gear was holding up ok and did a few control surface adjustments. (Reduced some aileron throws and adjusted some expo settings etc.) Pointed her into the wind, took a deep breath and let her go ...
Well she started to track nice and straight then suddenly started to veer to the left and try as I might I couldn't get her to straighten ... so I made the same error that I always do when this happens, I just commited and basically hauled her off the ground just before she ran into the beans to the left of the runway. (facing north) The correct thing to do was to have aborted the takeoff run and started over. By all rights she should have stalled out and crashed right there but there was sooooo much power on tap that I basically was able to horse her out of a stall and away we went.
Didn't need but two clicks of right aileron trim and she was flying like she was on rails. She actually flew "lighter" then my Decathlon which at the same AUW (20lbs) has almost TWICE the wing area! (1158 sq inches as opposed to 857 for the Tiffie)
Flew a few circuits testing things like dropping and raising the gear etc, did a couple of stall tests and she seemed to get really nice and slow before she would drop a wing. Anyway, after a few nice flybys and circuits decided to try to start the process of bringing her down.
Now this is the my first warbird of this kinda weight and as we all know flying a warbird is the most unforgiving plane to fly (IMHO) ... there is no room for error. Even though we could see that she slowed up quite nicely I had it in my head that I must bring her in under quite a bit of power in case she snapped on me down low.
The problem was since I had decided not to use the flaps the first flight I just could NOT get the speed right. I made three attempts before the final one. To make matters worse I had too much throw on the elevators and too much expo. This resulted in that mushy feeling that expo initially gives you and then if you have too much throw WHAM ... it suddenly kicks in!
Long story short ... touched down hard ... bounced back into the air about six feet ... tried to flair as she was coming back down hard and she tipstalled on me. Wham! Into the ground ... from our vantage point all Rob and I saw was bits flying unto the air. At that velocity and with that weight I was pretty sure that it was gonna be a bag of bits.
To our amazement the plane was basically intact (they don't call it "the beast" for nothing!) ... it was just the cannons that we saw flying into the air. The wing had popped off (nylon hold down bolts did their job) and the tailwheel was hanging and there was a rip in the FG skin on the wing, and the retracts appear to be twisted ... but other than that it seemed all in one piece!
So ... once I get her repaired ... I will reduce that elevator throw by at least half and she should take off and land just like how she flew ... like a dream! ;)
Colin
Sorry it wasn't exactly how you wanted but congratulations!
Sounds like you have a plan to get her sorted.
Nice one Colin.
Sounds like you have a great model. Once you have those adjustments (minor repairs!) done it should be wonderful sight at the field. Look forward to seeing it, and you, more often.
That was a lot of hard work and it sounds like it will be a great flyer.
Congratulations.
Jack.
PS Any photos?
J.
Congratulations Colin, for a fantastic test flight! Sure, the take-off could have been straighter, and the landing a bit smother, but the mission was accomplished. The plane flew really well, trimmed out easily, and looked GREAT in the air. It even sounded powerful and impressive.
Once you get that minor repair done, you can start enjoying the plane, and have many impressive flights with it.
Here are some ground shots:
O.K. The video sucks! Too shaky, the battery died, and I have to figure out how to get rid of that auto focus....
But you'll get the idea:
Colins Test Flight (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IhpFry76lsA#)
Hey that take off looks MUCH better than it actually was! Hard to see how she had veered to the left looking at the plane side on as opposed to me being behind the plane and thinking "oh no, she;s going into the beans!"
On one hand it's good that we didn't get the "crash landing" on video (since it really sucked) but on the other hand it would have been good to analyse what went wrong. Anyway, thanks for posting!
Colin
Oh, we KNOW what went wrong. ;D
Actually, the video looks great!
The veering to the left on takeoff is common on WW2 tail-dragger models.
The torque from the prop does this and is normally controlled with right rudder immediately upon pushing the throttle.
Hey Colin,
That looked Great! Reminds me of how my P-47 Flew. You'll have the bugs worked out in no time. Also cool that some video was taken!
Remember this plane guys? :) Well, since the "rough" landing I haven't really picked it backup. However I figured I'd get it repaired so that I can finally try to get my "balsa" builds attended to! Anyways ... the damage was mainly superficial and amounts to the following:
- Tear in the wing skin (its a fiberglass model) on the underside of the wing.
- Wing dowel broken
- Left retract was busted (Oooooh THAT one hurt!)
- Few other cosmetic scrapes and cracks
That's it! I think Rob would agree after we saw the bits fly off the model upon final impact that it would have been much much worse! (Actually the bits that were flying off turned out to be my detachable cannons. ;D)
Anyways, here are a couple of pics of the main damage.
Colin.
Typical fiber glass repair. Ca the cracks/tears and then fill with your filler of choice. I also had to refabricate a new piece for the rear of the wing center ... made it out of lite ply.
Colin
Wow, that's fast progress, Colin.
I was so disappointed not to see this plane last year, I cant wait to see the new & improved version in 2014! ;D
Yeah, I've GOT to get this flying properly this year ... its been too long in the making. Actually flying it was a breeze ... it's the landing that's a challenge. Landing a heavy warbird compared to your typical sport plane landing is like NIGHT AND DAY. The whole technique is completely different so I've got to get through this learning curve fast.
Even though this is not a big plane at 72 inches, its heavy like heck and as such has the wing loading of a giant scale warbird ... and its the wing loading that makes these kinds of planes such a challenge. There is absolutely no glide ratio ... if you stop or even slow down too much you just drop like a brick. Take a look at this video, the plane at 3.05 in illustrated exactly what happened to me with my landing (he good ole' "bounce and stall") only I didn't even use flaps like these guys (as I should have) so now I don't feel so bad!
Colin
http://youtu.be/xaNY49aja5c (http://youtu.be/xaNY49aja5c)
On the bright side... 95% of the landings in this video are right side up. Which is more than I can say for my own landings last season!
Quote from: gordonbw on January 10, 2014, 08:09:09 PM
On the bright side... 95% of the landings in this video are right side up. Which is more than I can say for my own landings last season!
True! :)
Ok ... so I've got the repair all buttoned up ... just have to rub down the high fill primer and repaint and she's as good as new!
Oh, almost forgot ... I'd also ripped my tail wheel off as well so I had to replace the spring, reassemble and reinstall it but that was a relatively easy job.
Colin
Quote from: wollins on January 10, 2014, 06:04:31 PM
Yeah, I've GOT to get this flying properly this year ... its been too long in the making. Actually flying it was a breeze ... it's the landing that's a challenge. Landing a heavy warbird compared to your typical sport plane landing is like NIGHT AND DAY. The whole technique is completely different so I've got to get over this learning curve fast.
Even though this is not a big plane at 72 inches, its heavy like heck and as such has the wing loading of a giant scale warbird ... and its the wing loading that makes these kinds of planes such a challenge. There is absolutely no glide ratio ... if you stop or even slow down too much you just drop like a brick. Take a look at this video, the plane at 3.05 in illustrated exactly what happened to me with my landing (he good ole' "bounce and stall") only I didn't even use flaps like these guys (as I should have) so now I don't feel so bad!
Colin
http://youtu.be/xaNY49aja5c (http://youtu.be/xaNY49aja5c)
Thanks for posting this video Colin. It is very instructive re handling large aircraft with high wing loadings. I can't believe the amount of bounce, even on landings that appear to be going really well. You really have to be ahead of the plane on these guys.
Way to go on the repairs to the Typhoon. Very much looking forward to seeing it fly this season.
Cheers!
Andy
Thanks Andy ... I appreciate that.
So I decided to add some clevises to my pull pull cables at the tail wheel end. (see pic at the end) Previously I just had them crimped directly at the connection (the tlller arm) as is fairly standard.
Decided to change this because when my whole tail wheel assembly was ripped out of the fuse, even though they were still connected to the cables, I still had to reassemble it to attach a new spring. To do this I had no choice but to cut the cables to get it off and since I didn't have more cable at hand that added a bit of a delay to the whole process.
This way if anything were to happen that needed the unit to be repaired or changed out I can just disconnect it at the clevises. This will come in handy soon enough because I'll eventually be reinstalling a PROPER retract unit. (not the cheap Turnigy one that's in there now which burned out after about 20 cycles! See video) Another cool thing about this is I can now adjust/fine tune the steering of the tailwheel at the tiller arm.
Colin
http://youtu.be/Ua4Dn4P_83Y (http://youtu.be/Ua4Dn4P_83Y)
Great job, Colin! Get that plane fixed up so we can see it tearing up the skies in the spring!
Quote from: piker on January 13, 2014, 10:15:14 AM
Great job, Colin! Get that plane fixed up so we can see it tearing up the skies in the spring!
That's the plan! I actually can't wait to fly it at Kingston, lots of room for error there. (except for their crosswinds sometimes) Gonna put it aside for now since all that's left is the cosmetic stuff. Painting, weathering etc etc.
Hopefully by the time you come over Wed the bench will have the 415 laid out on it! ;)
Colin
A little green makes it look oh so clean. ;D Ok its now been put aside to make way for these plans!
Colin
Yahoo! Canadian content! Great choice! I got water bombed by one last summer!
Quote from: wollins on August 23, 2013, 11:49:31 PM
Well, the Tiffie has flown! Let me summarise this maiden flight report like this:
The take off was hairy scary ... the flight was beautiful ... the landing was terrible ...
which resulted in ... A CRASH!! :o
Now I REALLY don't feel so bad! Read about this real life experience with the full size. :o Lets hope I can tame the beast this summer.
Colin
Ya, don't build it too scale!