hi simon it is iliyan. do i have to use my trojan to get my wings or can i use my extra 260 3d 480 to get my wings.
this is the extra 260. look at the video and then tell me if i can get my wings on it
http://www.horizonhobby.com/products/super-cub-dsm-rtf-EFL2475 (http://www.horizonhobby.com/products/super-cub-dsm-rtf-EFL2475)
Please limit all training questions to the "Flight Instruction" section.
Our CFI will set the guidelines and rules for our training program. That is Mike.
I would say you need to use a Trainer type aircraft to get your wings. Your Trojan would be OK. The Extra would not. But final decision is up to Mike.
ok
Patience is the word of the day here.
The process of earning ones' wings is not a short one. You've only been flying at the club for a very short time, and have yet to really experience the flight training program. I hate to put time frames on these types of things but it's safe to say that you won't earn your wings this season.
I am currently working on some new guidelines for TEMAC in terms of Wings and what types of aircraft would allow pilots to earn their wings. The traditional club process is somewhat obsolete now since there is such a wide selection of ready to fly park size planes available. Previously, new pilots had to first build a kit model and outfit it with a power plant (these were almost always IC engines) usually over the winter, and then start flying it in the spring. I won't go into specifics, however I'm currently looking at how pilots can move from RTF models to larger and faster kits safely.
In the meantime here are somethings to consider:
The Wings program requires pilots to demonstrate:
1. Consistent control of their model while flying in the normal traffic pattern in various conditions.
2. A complete understanding of the safe operation of their models. This includes both in the air and on the ground.
3. A safe and responsible approach to flying their models at the club.
For all prospective wings candidates I would recommend:
1. That you learn as much as you can about RC modelling. Including construction, and best practices. The quality of your models will speak volumes about your attitude towards safety. By quality, I don't mean how much you paid for it, but rather the attention to detail you have put into assembling it and whether or not you install equipment properly.
2. Use a simulator and practice, practice, practice.
3. When you do get to fly your model. Fly with a purpose. Have a plan for your flights and stick to it. For example, you might want to work on rudder coordination one day, and then work on landing approaches another. Don't just throw your model in the sky and whip it around.
Mike
Great to see the online group growing and there is a lot of good information available.
Make good use of this forum as these guys are experienced and won't steer you wrong. As far as learning to fly it's not just taking off, bashing around and landing. There are lots of situations and precautions one must master prior to being given your wings. Take your time and enjoy it. It will pay back in your ability in a very short time.
Mike some great thoughts and I commend you on your instruction this season. You dedicated a lot of your time and efforts and it shows.
I've been flying 28 years and still trying to improve!(I did take a couple breaks)
That a great point Ed about not just bashing around the sky. A question for discussion: does anyone think that cheap foam airframes and low cost power systems has caused the usual careful learning curve to be shortened?
I was probably more adverse to crashing than most when I was first starting out. But I built my built-up trainer over a winter and I spent all of my time and energy trying to ensure that it didn't crash. I flew it for years. It feels like the more "disposable" foam airframes wouldn't demand the same knee-shaking caution from new pilots. Thoughts?
Ben
Absolutly Ben I agree that there has been a swing brought on by the cheap ARF planes available now. We used to spend days getting things right, picking equipment and dreading there demise. Now you can just buy another! It IS sort of an advantage as you can get right back on the horse but some of that worry I think made us concentrate more on mastering flying.
I'll be honest - with foam and a hot glue-gun, I would say that almost all the fear of crashing has gone, with a foamy. I know that most times (thanks to Gerg C's coaching) I can be in the air again in the matter of a few hours.
This has been bad for me making the transition to balsa aircraft, because the caution and concentration is sometimes less than ideal (like when I try a knife edge lower than I should) and I end up crashing and causing hours, and hours of damage to my balsa aircraft. Or, as in the case of my Edge, completely writing it off.
I'm not sure that foam is a bad thing, but it's certainly changed the hobby.
I know what you mean. It's as though foam is good for people who already know how to fly--it allows them to try a wider variety of aircraft and to grow their skill with less risk.
For beginner pilots it tends to encourage the "crash course" (no pun intended) mode of learning where the stakes are low and therefore the basic concentration and sense of responsibility that older flyers were forced to learn before foamies were popular is often missing in new flyers learning with foam--my son included.
The first ARF vs Kit arguments that took place years ago when ARFs were on the rise was in a similar vein. The sense of achievement and the rush you get from watching something you actually spent time making fly through the air is lost with ARFs. With foamies it's even worse because the fear of crashing is gone as well.
I suggest that it's worth spending the time to learn how to build and to build kits anyway because when you do so flying the finished plane in simple circuits with a simple landing is more of a rush than flying a foamy ARF or BNF whether it's a 200mph pylon racer or maneuvering warbird. I have a mix of planes myself (ARFs and kits) but I wish I had more time to build kits.
Interesting food for thought.
Ben
I know this is an excuse, but (I assume that) Les would be unhappy with all the balsa dust at home. I get in enough trouble as it it, just building foam ARFs.
I wish I had Cadez's basement!!! Lol :D
Quote from: Ededge2002 on September 27, 2012, 10:06:53 AM
Mike some great thoughts and I commend you on your instruction this season. You dedicated a lot of your time and efforts and it shows.
Trust me, it's been a team effort this season.
Ed, has a point, lots of us were helping each other this year to make sure that we are all having fun in the air.
In all the comments above, each type of plane has it advantages. I like foam for the fact that they can be repaired quickly and take a fair amount of abuse.
I enjoy the durablility and good looks of the wood planes. Although my stress levels increase when in the air.
In the last month, I think that I only purchased wood planes and kits. Maybe I am ramping up for a long winter in the basement. ;o)
Quote from: thehaze on September 27, 2012, 02:55:53 PM
Quote from: Ededge2002 on September 27, 2012, 10:06:53 AM
Mike some great thoughts and I commend you on your instruction this season. You dedicated a lot of your time and efforts and it shows.
Trust me, it's been a team effort this season.
I guess there is no I in team!
unless you spell it wrong ;)
No U in tomorrow! ;D
Quote from: bfeist on September 27, 2012, 01:45:57 PM
That a great point Ed about not just bashing around the sky. A question for discussion: does anyone think that cheap foam airframes and low cost power systems has caused the usual careful learning curve to be shortened?
I was probably more adverse to crashing than most when I was first starting out. But I built my built-up trainer over a winter and I spent all of my time and energy trying to ensure that it didn't crash. I flew it for years. It feels like the more "disposable" foam airframes wouldn't demand the same knee-shaking caution from new pilots. Thoughts?
Ben
I don't dispute that, but on the other hand, it's the availability of these planes and the ease in which one can get them in the air that has grown the hobby.
I'll be the first to admit that I'm more of a pilot than a modeler. And I'm not sure I'd be doing this if I had to kit build. And trust me, I'm always scared when I'm flying a model for the first time (and for one model.. every time I fly it) , foam or not.
From a training perspective, it's a game changer and it's forcing clubs like ours to look at new ways to accommodate a new kind of flyer. Some people want to fly large and complex models, while others are happy to fly foamies and micros. It's the range of choice that makes this hobby so much fun.
Quote from: sihinch on September 27, 2012, 03:39:34 PM
No U in tomorrow! ;D
Those are the words that started the summer of Mike! Thank you Dalton!
Quote from: thehaze on September 27, 2012, 03:47:52 PM
Quote from: sihinch on September 27, 2012, 03:39:34 PM
No U in tomorrow! ;D
Those are the words that started the summer of Mike! Thank you Dalton!
That's a great point Mike. I know I sounded a bit like an old guy pining for the good old days. I'm as big a fan as any of the transformation this hobby has enjoyed in recent years. I think it's interesting to look back and track what impact those changes have had and why, that's all.
Cheers,
Ben
I'd like to add two cents to this discussion. Suppose a new pilot comes out with a foamy, earns his wings and then decides to move on to another club. And his next airplane is a 50cc gasser. No one at that club can confirm or deny that pilot's ability to fly until some serious carnage has occured. As far as they are concerned that pilot has his wings (even if he is not really capable of piloting such an aircraft). It would really look bad on TEMAC if shortcuts are permitted. Keep up the solid training program guys. It pays great dividends. To the new pilots: trust your instructors. They can recognize who "gets it" quick and who needs extra training. The goal of every instructor is to produce safe, competent pilots who are able to fully maximize the joy that this hobby brings.
Just a thought from a former instructor.
Andre
Andre, that is a valid point for sure...
I know that I have been playing with 1/4 scale electrics now. A year ago this was not possible. Electric planes are limited to certain sizes and types. Mainly due to technology. It would make sense to have a graduated wings system if anything. But common sense should be applied. Even though I have my wings, I would not consider a large gasser. Mainly due to the fact I have no experience with them. I had a person ask me if I wanted to try his 1/3 gasser. I said no, but inside I was "oh baby!".
But in all fairness, the person should know what thier limitations are, regardless of wings.
Quote from: the giant on September 28, 2012, 11:49:20 AM
As far as they are concerned that pilot has his wings (even if he is not really capable of piloting such an aircraft). It would really look bad on TEMAC if shortcuts are permitted.
This is the very issue that occupies most of my time! Lots of our newest members are joining the club and getting started by flying models that are not what one would consider the classic club trainer. And there's nothing wrong with that. IMHO if it can fly, and you're having fun with it, then it's a fine model. However, there needs to be a graduated system in place to allow for new pilots to transition into larger models safely
if they choose to do so.
I think there's a way to make this all work. I'm looking at how other clubs are treating this, but I think TEMAC, as the only exclusively electric club in the zone, (and probably the most likely club of choice for the park pilot) needs to be ahead of the curve, rather than behind it. I'm particularly interested at how the AMA decided to deal with park flyers. http://www.theparkpilot.org/. (http://www.theparkpilot.org/.) I'd like to see the same from MAAC, but I think they've got other issues to deal with right now.
Quote"I think they've got other issues to deal with right now."
Ya think? lol
Quote from: Ededge2002 on September 28, 2012, 03:27:24 PM
Quote"I think they've got other issues to deal with right now."
Ya think? lol
I was being polite. ;)
Quote from: the giant on September 28, 2012, 11:49:20 AM
Suppose a new pilot comes out with a foamy, earns his wings and then decides to move on to another club. And his next airplane is a 50cc gasser. No one at that club can confirm or deny that pilot's ability to fly until some serious carnage has occured. As far as they are concerned that pilot has his wings (even if he is not really capable of piloting such an aircraft). Andre
At our club, when we have pilots wanting to join and who may hold wings from another club. A check flight and a field orientation is required with one of our club instructors before being allowed to fly.
The instructor can easily see if the new member can fly safely or will require more instruction.
Chris