My 2103/14 winter building project has just started.
This will be a balsa kit-built DC3, and will probably be finished in the Canadian scheme as in the image below.
There is a huge amount of balsa wood and plywood in this kit; see the image of the open box with a ruler across the box.
So far, I have spent over 2 hours just cutting apart and assembling the plans, and then removing most of the die-cut wood parts from their sheets and putting them into plastic bags, one for wing, fuselage, etc. You can get a sense of the size of the model by the photo of the fuselage side-view plan, also with a ruler on top for comparison.
I'm estimating that this will take about 4 months to build.
I will be using 2 E-Flite 32 brushless motors and 2 60 amp speed controls. I haven't figured out where everything will go, and I still have to order retracts.
Looks like its going to be really nice once finished ;D
Good luck with it Michael :)
Very nice Michael. I love your choice of schemes its gorgeous.
Construction started.
Stabilizer skeleton.
Wow! Another cool build from the Rogozinsky workbench AND...done in CANADIAN COLOURS! :D
Great choices! I'm really interested in the retracts you're planning to use...scale?
Yes, well, nearly scale.
Hey! I thought the Boss said you couldn't start building your new plane until you finished cleaning the garage!
Still, lookin' good!
Yes, well, nearly clean. ;D
Guessing you're planning the Robarts #619 mains retract system for your model.
1. Have you figured out how to drive these electrically or are you going to use the air system?
2. I don't see any oleo or spring action in these units...am I missing anything?
I'm really curious about these as I think they might work on the Avro Anson dad and I are building over the winter.
Good luck with your gooney bird!
This is what I'm planning for the retracts.
Top Flite DC-3 Electric Retracts (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q5GKgvPXbYs#ws)
very cool!
Nice Michael,
Where did you find that kit?
Glenn
The kit is still commercially available.
I got it at A+J's.
Robart Mfg. Ziroli DC-3/C-47 Electric Retracts (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ETrZV3d3h0Q#ws)
Here's the Zirolli electric conversion, looks real scale.
Jack.
Elevator construction done. That was quite a bit more work than I expected.
The fin is next, and it is a bit more complicated.
It might have been a bit more work than you expected but it looks fabulous!
Take your time you've got all winter...
Quote from: Michael on November 02, 2013, 05:20:45 PM
Elevator construction done. That was quite a bit more work than I expected.
The fin is next, and it is a bit more complicated.
I was going to joke that you were "almost done", but then I saw how complex that stab and elevator is in the photo. She'll be a beaut when you're done!
It's gorgeous.
Will you be offering rides in it?
No rides, Simon.
*****************
I've started work on the fin, which seems more complicated than the elevator/stabilizer.
There are two versions of fin/rudder construction in this kit; one simpler version and a scale version. I'm going with the scale version.
This small amount of balsa shown here already involves more than 2 hours of measuring, cutting, sanding, drilling and gluing; I could have assembled several Bind-N-Flys in that time. ;D
There was an almost complete kit at the London swap meet, I think Greg C may have bought it!
Fin and rudder construction well under way.
This was several hours work, but it looks pretty good.
The hinge line is the brass tube that extends top and bottom.
It's coming along nicely, Michael. It'll be fantastic when it's done.
Yup- she's going to be a beaut Michael. Any thoughts of a parachute drop feature, either people or cargo? Sure would be cool!
Tom
With the amount of effort and cost going into this project, the main 3 features I want are:
1. Smooth takeoff.
2. Smooth, stable flight.
3. Smooth landing.
;D
So, you want it all then Michael?! Lol
Fin/rudder main construction finished.
(The little Robert Pike in my head keeps telling me to sand it even more. ;D )
Anyway, the fuselage is next, and I've got to clean up the mess I've made from the tail 'feathers'.
Looks great and moving right along. The model in London had some form of balsa blocker on it. I was reading somewhere that film glues much better to balsa block than to raw wood. I'm going to experiment with some water based acrylic and see how it works with film.
Jack.
Fuselage started. I'll have to pay attention and start thinking about a battery hatch about now.
That's a big model.
Would there be room in the wings/nacelles for the batteries as in the deuces wild?
Jack.
The nacelles also hold the retracted landing gear and the servos. I don't know if there's room.
If you put the batteries in the fuse, then you might also want to put the ESCs there as well to avoid long battery leads.
Following this thread makes me want to pull out the Gold edition P47 I started several years ago but never finished.
Tail feathers are done, Fuse done to the point of sheeting the top half and wing framed up but no sheeting.
(Got stuck on doing a scale retracting tail wheel and more realistic main wheel wells and doors, then sort of never got back at it :-[)
At the rate you are going you will have caught up to me and pass me by in a couple of weeks :)
Pat MacKenzie
More fuselage and tail work. Elevator and rudder linkages will be fully inside the fuselage.
Stabilizer and fin glued onto the fuselage. Top sheeting is next.
The P-47 sounds close, Pat. Will you finish it for next summer? You should!
Yes, I saw Michael's DC3 today. It looks very nice. Well done!
Robert
Yeah, Pat, finish it! ;D
Top stringers done. That's it for tonight.
One more step; one more photo.
Michael.
Please stop making so much progress on your "winter" project.
I have yet to even hold a knife this season and your kicking my butt with your progress.
Thanks. The remaining members of temac.
He's stoked on hot chocolate.
Ed get your dopamine levels up and you too can make progress.
jack.
I'm with Ed. Stop making us look bad. I've only laid my plans out so far.
A couple more hours work. That's about it for the next 10 days or so, due to my working schedule.
Ok, back to building.
Lower fuselage construction underway, and internal rudder and elevator linkages being set up.
That's coming along really nicely, Michael. Nice structure and linkages!
Laminated stringers. More work, but easier and more fun.
One more image before the fuselage is closed up; I'm working on the fuselage sheeting. Eventually, the seams will be filled and then rough sanded. Later on in the construction, a finer sanding will be done.
I have made my first modification on the model. I moved the rudder and elevator servos one bay back, in case I decide to place the flight batteries in the fuselage.
Main fuselage sheeting complete. That was a weekend's worth of work. Most seams have been filled light filler, and I'll sand it this week. There is still a lot of work on the fuselage to be done.
How are you going to do the scale large puddles of oil under the motors each time you park it?
It looks great Michael nice progress.
Nice. very Nice.
Still working on the fuselage.
Nose block glued on and rough-sanded, cockpit made into a battery hatch, more work on the tail area, dorsal fin built and installed, and lots of filling and sanding. I hope to finish the main construction of the fuselage this weekend.
Gorgeous!
Looks like a real DC3.
Beautiful work.
Jack.
I'm glad to see your keeping the can of whipped cream out of your photos.
Classic lines of a beautiful plane Michael. It looks great
It looks like the last photo, but has at least 6 hours more work in it.
Still needs sanding, but a lot has been done, especially near the tail. A hatch at the rear bottom has been made in case adjustments are needed for rudder and elevator.
It's been 5 weeks so far, and I'm enjoying the building. At this rate (the wing is more complicated than the fuselage), I estimate at least 2 more months, maybe 3, to finish and paint.
I'll start the center section of the wing in a day or two.
Looks fabulous Michael. Thank you for continuing to share with us. :D
Working on the wing center section, ....
Between last night and tonight, I spent 2½ hours gluing together firewalls, adjusting ribs, making spars, and I still have more of that kind of stuff to do before I even get close to gluing a rib to anything!
Anyway, it's slow progress and there's nothing worth photographing at this point.
A bit of progress on the center wing section.
I'm mostly following instructions, but modifying just a bit for the servo-driven retracts and for electric power.
Look at the size and that's just the centre wing section.
Nice looking work.
Jack.
As no one seems to follow my "beer bottle for scale" requests we need to come to some kind of agreement!
The instruction manual in the photo worked for me.
I worked for Carling O'Keefe for a while and I can tell you have beer can fixation.
There is a cure for that, it's called wine!
or in your case whine!
Jack.
That looks fantastic!
As we get older we sometimes begin to doubt our ability to "make a difference" in the world. It is at these times that our hopes are boosted by the remarkable achievements of other "seniors" who have found the courage to take on challenges that would make many of us wither.
Harold Schlumberg is such a person.
THIS IS QUOTED FROM HAROLD:
"I've often been asked, 'What do you do now that you're retired?'
Well... I'm fortunate to have a chemical engineering background and one of the things I enjoy most is converting beer, wine and whiskey into urine. It's rewarding, uplifting, satisfying and fulfilling. I do it every day and I really enjoy it."
Harold is an inspiration to us all.
I don't have a chemical engineering degree but I follow Harold's recipe for a happy retirement...daily.
There is merit in Ed's attempt to provide a size reference for our photos and no, I don't want to see any pictures of TEMACers naked in their workshops using beer bottles as ... 8)
Really impressed with the DC-3!
Left wing started.
Each rib and the spar had to be filed to fit diagonally on each other, and spars were built up from 2 pieces each.
More progress.
Top Flite DC3 retracts with JR servos (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8fNq3anq2LI#ws)
Looks super, Moving right along eh!
Jack.
That looks amazing! Super cool mechanism.
Way to go Michael and thanks again for keeping us all up to date with the mega build.
S
very nice!!!
I've been very quiet lately (so busy) but I just wanted to say how fantastic your plane is coming together. Good job!.. to you Michael, and everyone else who's building away. Keep up the great work!
Robert
OK, a long stretch of work at the office is clearing, and I put a little more time into the wing.
Basic structure of outer panels are done and glued to center section. It was actually quite a bit of work.
I had wanted removable wing sections, but since there is so much going on within the wings (wires, retracts, aileron-flap and retract servos, etc.) there was little room for changes. It's a big wing, but it will fit in my SUV.
I started on the nacelles and made adjustments for mounting the electric motors.
The nacelles will hold the motors, retracts, retract servos and flap servos, plus it will have passing through it wires to the speed controls and wires from the aileron servos.
Looks magic! Great to see it coming together.
Those nacelles are going to hold quite a bit! Build them strong.
What's your glue of choice?
CA (thin and medium) and epoxy.
A few more hours on the wing installing servo rails, dihedral braces, retract braces, gussets, nacelle parts, hinge anchor blocks, etc., and then the bottom sheeting.
I can't believe you're allowed to build on Christmas Day!!!
Oh, is today Christmas? ;D
We went to a friend for a long 3-hour lunch, and now I'm back building the center-flap.
The wing has a 3-section flap, and each section is built up with ribs and all kinds of little bits.
The center-flap bottom sheet (about 2" x 20") is built up from 2 different sheets of balsa and one of ply; lots of work, but fun!
I'll have to stop soon for supper and an evening with other friends, and when I finally get them out of the way, I'll get back to my flaps!
3 (split) flap sections hinged (but not glued) in place, and flap servos and hatches installed.
Very neat looking work. How does it work with 3 sections and two servos?
Jack
Sections are joined by a loose wire inside secured brass tubes.
Very nice, Michael!!! I'm plugging away at my Stranraer again after a period of little progress, so it's nice to see others building away for motivation.
Great work... as always!
Thanks Robert, but truth be told, you are the who motivated me to start building again.
I'm really enjoying it!
Plans change! I've made 2 corrections/deviations from earlier planning.
The first correction was due to a mistake I made with one of the flap servos. I installed the servos in opposite directions, like we normally do with ailerons, but the flaps servos need to move in the same direction, both pushing at the same time; not one pushing while the other pulls, like needed for ailerons. I could have solved this problem by using separate channels and transmitter programming, but I preferred not to do that. I re-positioned the servo and opened a new hole in the flap servo hatch cover. The new hole and closed old hole are visible in the photo.
The second was a result of the electric conversion. The retracts take up quite a bit of room in the nacelles and it would have been difficult to get the power wires around them, so I repositioned the motor with the wires on top, and cut channels for the wires to get into the wings. There is about a centimeter of clear room above the retracts, and that's where the wires will be. You can see the cutouts in the firewall, nacelle wall and rib, in the photo. This will be completely covered up once the nacelle is fully constructed.
All wing-interior wiring complete, and the wing is ready for top sheeting, and then nacelle construction.
Note the 2 flap servos in the same direction.
I'll take a break now and consider building something small and simple for the indoor funfly.
Love it - 2 days until the indoor fly and Michael decides to just knock something together! Something simple. We all know it will be a masterpiece!
How about a small, depron DC3?
Quote from: sihinch on December 27, 2013, 02:00:08 PM
How about a small, depron DC3?
Actually, that was the plan, but there's not enough time for that.
I'm working on something smaller.
Not enough time (or interest) to build a micro model for tomorrow.
I did build a fuselage and put together a power and radio system, but I'd rather work on the DC3.
I'm working slowly on the top skins of the wings.
See! It's hard to get excited about a dopey indoor model when you're building an awesome scale masterpiece!
Masterpiece? I'm not sure, but it is more fun! ;D
Wing bottom fully sheeted and top outer wing panels sheeted.
More to go, and the split flaps covers and ailerons to build, and then of course, a whole lot of filling and sanding.
Flap covers installed. Each cover is made up of 2 pieces of balsa and a piece of plywood, cut to size and then sanded to shape.
Also, the center section of the wing has been cut open, for access to the wiring.
Note the wires are labeled for radio functions, and the opening has rounded corners; I'm pretending to be organized and neat. ;D
Aileron construction underway.
Looking really good Michael- have you decided on the covering method yet?
Tom
Water-based polyurethane and fiberglass, and then paint.
Was wondering if you were going wirh WBPU or epoxy resin- enquiring minds.... :)
Tom
Lookin' great! Keep up the good work!
BTW, don't forget Colin's excellent recommendation for sealing the wood before you apply a heavy coat of WBPU... Is THAT what you were asking about last night?
I don't know what I'm going to do. ;D
When I get to that point, I'll ask everyone for input.
Main wing construction is complete. Next will be filling and sanding, and then building the nacelles.
Time for a well-deserved hangar-flight. It looks like an airplane!
Looks sweet! Now get back to work. We're really anxious to see the finished product!! :)
Andy
OK, back at work, but now I'm done for the evening.
The wing has been filled, and will be dry and ready for sanding tomorrow morning.
OK, I don't have a beer can to use as reference, but Jack said he'd volunteer a beer belly. ;D
Looks great Michael! impressive size and build. Oh and the plane is nice too!
Flap and aileron linkages installed. These will be fine-tuned once the model is painted and the flap and aileron hinges are glued in place.
Next is the nacelle construction. I may not get to thay until the weekend.
I'm back to work tomorrow, so progress will return to a slower but more normal pace.
Nacelles under construction.
See the rounded notches to leave room for the mounting spacers.
Are those landing lights that I can see drooped over the wing, behind the nacelle?
Very impressive build.
I think RAF color scheme! Lol
Those are just speed control wires.
The plane will have Canadian colours.
Tried to post, but got message 'too big' Is there a size limit on what can be posted?
Bigstik
Quote from: Michael on January 04, 2014, 06:50:19 AM
Those are just speed control wires.
The plane will have Canadian colours.
:D!
Nice work Michael. it shows that you've been hanging around Piker a lot.
I have a new project as well. Had Don Wilson of Don's Balsa Grimsby cut a short kit of Island Aircraft Spectra amphibian. It was in RCM magazine afew years back and Laddie updated/modified the plans. He flew his at the EMFSO OEF Expo in 2007.
The plane is very similar in design to the Seawind, but imho better looking and Laddie said it flies better.
Nice plane, Al.
Yup! I've been hanging around with Piker quite a bit, and that's who I curse each time I have to go back and do more sanding!
;D
Nacelle basic construction is done.
Each plastic cowl is made of 3 pieces of thick styrene, and each had to be carefully cut out and assembled.
Those alone took about 2 hours to build.
Photos show: basic wood construction; nacelles sheeted and with some filler; nacelles after rough sanding and cowls installed; cowl and nacelle on wing-bottom.
Lots of work Michael but is looking very DC3!
This build thread takes the cake! Your progress is amazingly fast.
BTW, that picture of Jack verifies my suspicion that he is the real builder behind all of this progress (now that he's an expert after the scratch build course). :)
Ben
Quote from: piker on December 30, 2013, 06:14:16 PM
Lookin' great! Keep up the good work!
BTW, don't forget Colin's excellent recommendation for sealing the wood before you apply a heavy coat of WBPU... Is THAT what you were asking about last night?
Here's a previous post on what I did for the nooner wing (to seal before applying WBPU). http://temac.ca/smf/index.php/topic,4357.msg25527.html#msg25527 (http://temac.ca/smf/index.php/topic,4357.msg25527.html#msg25527)
It's been a productive weekend. Next is the wing fillets, and then a complete sanding.
The next couple weeks may be busy at work, so probably not a lot will be done on this model.
It's still on schedule to be finished by the end of February.
Time for a little more 'hangar flying'.
I really like your DC-3. It's beautiful. But I really, REALLY, REALLY like your scratch-built assemby table with the scale astro-turf covering. I sure hope you're going to bring that to the field with your DC-3. It really enhances the overall aesthetics - and it would be a great platform for photographing your plane and other people's winter projects! :D
Andy
That looks fantastic! I hate you!
Quote from: Michael on January 05, 2014, 06:57:27 PM
It's been a productive weekend. Next is the wing fillets, and then a complete sanding.
The next couple weeks may be busy at work, so probably not a lot will be done on this model.
It's still on schedule to be finished by the end of February.
Time for a little more 'hangar flying'.
Is that Toblerone in photo #054 going to be used for cargo? How many hours of building can you get out of a chocolate bar that size??
Andy
Quote from: piker on January 05, 2014, 10:11:52 PM
That looks fantastic! I hate you!
From you, Robert, that is the highest form of praise one can get, when it comes to building a model airplane! ;D
I'm impressed with your task accomplishment rate! Wow!
Model looks great and reminds me of the Millardair DC-3 that took me for a Christmas lights flight over Toronto way back when flights like that cost $5.00!(yeah I know... The Jurassic Era!). Also remids me of the Great Lakes Airlines DC-3s I loaded as a university student/summer time ramp hand at Malton(aka Pearson)
Talk about an aircraft with a long and distinguished history!...It's been around longer than I have...great choice Michael!
Hey Michael,
It was really nice to see the fully assembled DC3 last night. It looks SO nice and I think we're all looking forward to watching the next construction steps. It'll be an exciting test flight at TEMAC in the spring.
OK, back to it!
I just spent about 3 hours fitting, adjusting and gluing on a plywood wing saddle and plastic wing fillets.
(I cut out and shaped the wing fillets a few days ago; that took a couple hours too.)
I also put on a light filler along the edges, and will sand that tomorrow, and then apply another layer, as well as some other balsa parts to fill in the bottom.
Phew, you're back. I thought you'd sold the DC3 ;)
I'm working on the bottom of the wing fillets where they merge into the fuselage.
This is the last stage of construction!
One this is done, hopefully some time this weekend, I will start some sanding and preparation for fiber-glassing and finishing.
Of course, I still have to finish the radio installation and other component placement.
This is a list for me to do:
1. Finish fillets and sand final shape.
2. Remove all landing gear and other things not to be painted.
3. Fill and sand entire model (twice).
4. Seal the balsa so it won't warp when painted.
5. Sand again.
6. Cover with fiberglass and water-based polyester-urethane.
7. Sand again, and sand plastic parts.
8. Another coat and more sanding.
9. Spray model and plastic parts with primer.
10. Install motors, landing gear, and all components.
11. Install battery tray, battery, and balance the model.
12. Finish battery hatch.
13. Remove motors, landing gear, and all non-to-be-painted components.
14. Paint model. (One step. That sounds easy).
15. Re-install motors, landing gear, and all components.
16. Find and install suitable propellers.
17. Fly model.
Maybe only 800 hrs. or so left to go, Michael- you're almost there! (I'm glassing and sanding, sanding, sanding the Hornet right now- perhaps 2016 hrs. to completion)
Tom
(This is meant as encouragement) ;)
Wing saddle, fillets and parts complete.
Basic construction is FINISHED! Nearly 3 months!
Light overall sanding is next.
Excellent! Great work!
I'm spraying on a sealer, so that when I later apply the water-based poly-acrylic, the wood won't warp.
I'm doing this on our loading dock at work, so my house won't smell of the spray.
Still looks great. Did you check with Robert if you did enough sanding?
Michael, where did you get the nylon stand offs for the motor mounts? I keep going to Lowes as HB and RONA don't carry this stuff, but I need hundreds of them when doing 1/4 scale planes. I cleaned out Lowes last week and ran short again. Is there a place to buy them in bulk. They are great for quick conversions. Great work! It's going to be a great summer, I can't wait! :o
A few years ago, Colin Moses ordered a bunch of these, and he got a bag full of various sizes for me.
Actually, I have no more after this model, and would like to get some more.
Anybody know where we can get these?
Quote from: sihinch on January 21, 2014, 10:40:28 AM
Still looks great. Did you check with Robert if you did enough sanding?
I did not sand 'perfectly'.
I sanded 'pretty good'.
I'm on my way over to have a look and I'm bringing my inspection lamp!
Just kidding ;D Although I could... you and the plane are just down the road from where I sit right now :)
I will sand lightly before applying a light coat of poly-acrylic.
Once that dries, I will sand lightly before applying fiberglass cloth.
Once that dries, I will sand lightly before applying another coat of poly-acrylic.
If that suffices, I will sand again before applying a primer.
If needed, I will sand again and apply more primer.
Atta Boy!
... And we're off !!!!
Fiberglassing has commenced!
This could take a few days. I'm moving forward slowly and carefully, and it looks good so far.
I ordered decals/graphics today, and I bought counter-rotating (push and pull) 3-blade props.
Good luck.
:)
Quote from: Gregor77 on January 21, 2014, 11:29:41 AM
It's going to be a great summer, I can't wait! :o
It's a great winter! And it's here NOW!!! No waiting required! :D
Andy
I just used fiber-cloth in a way that regular iron-on covering would have been much more challenging.
I covered the middle upper section of the wing with a single sheet of cloth, including the nacelles.
Cool! It's quite satisfying, isn't it? :)
Yup! ;D
Quote from: Michael on January 21, 2014, 12:03:38 PM
A few years ago, Colin Moses ordered a bunch of these, and he got a bag full of various sizes for me.
Actually, I have no more after this model, and would like to get some more.
Anybody know where we can get these?
Mcmaster Carr sells them.
They won't normally ship to Canada unless you have an existing account with them.
If there is demand I can put in an order, pick up (from my place) only :).
(Or someone could pick up and get them to one of the pilot's meetings)
http://www.mcmaster.com/#nylon-spacers/=qf416z (http://www.mcmaster.com/#nylon-spacers/=qf416z)
If anyone is interested let me know what size(s) you want.
Lots of stuff there, so look around on the site. They sell almost everything,
including the kitchen sink :)
Pat MacKenzie
Quote from: Michael on January 24, 2014, 07:29:11 PM
I just used fiber-cloth in a way that regular iron-on covering would have been much more challenging.
I covered the middle upper section of the wing with a single sheet of cloth, including the nacelles.
That's amazing Michael! I can imagine trying to cover that with film covering!! Very nice work and encouraging to see the material work so well for you.
Fuselage mostly covered in fiberglass-cloth; fin being covered.
Slow but steady progress.
The entire model has been painted with primer, except the ailerons, elevator and rudder, which will be covered with fabric-textured iron-on covering.
Next step is to install the motors, and assemble the plane, and figure out where to put the batteries.
Note in the photo that I didn't yet trim off the fiber-cloth covering the center hatches in the wing.
That was simply to keep spray paint out.
Quote from: Michael on February 03, 2014, 02:24:17 PM
The entire model has been painted with primer, except the ailerons, elevator and rudder, which will be covered with fabric-textured iron-on covering.
Next step is to install the motors, and assemble the plane, and figure out where to put the batteries.
Note in the photo that I didn't yet trim off the fiber-cloth covering the center hatches in the wing.
That was simply to keep spray paint out.
What a difference a spray makes!! :D
Looking great Michael. When do we do the photo shoot?!
Andy
Andy will you please stop pushing the quote button. We've already read it and it takes up too much space. LOL LOL.
Jack.
Hey Michael:
How about some skis for your DC-3? Just think of that long, smooth runway! You could even ride on top of it from the highway to pits!
Andy
That's a cool picture!
Michael! You're priming already? Lookin' good!
Still a lot of work to go.
That's a Biggg Plane.
I haven't read the whole thread and maybe you already thought about this: There is a new TV show starting and they fly a DC 3. Paint yours the same?
Ken
I'm finishing in the scheme shown here:
Moving bits covered; not a single wrinkle! ;D
These will be painted, too.
That colour scheme is gorgeous.
Can I be 1st in line to buy this plane when you sell it? Lol
Wow,
That is coming along really nicely!
I like Andy's suggestion of skis, that plane is begging for some all weather flying up in the frozen Tundra. lol
Quote from: electroflyer on February 04, 2014, 08:11:55 AM
Wow,
That is coming along really nicely!
I like Andy's suggestion of skis, that plane is begging for some all weather flying up in the frozen Tundra. lol
Yeah! Michael's favourite habitat!! ;D
Andy
Have floats been mentioned?
Those amphib floats would be awesome on black water (Frenchman's Bay) AND on a Geotex runway, and, of course, on white water!! Go for it Michael!
Andy
General assembly started. I need to assemble everything and make a place for the batteries, and balance the model, before painting.
Tail 'feathers' are 'dry'- hinged in place.
I think it looks pretty good! ;D
I agree it does look very good.
Jack.
It looks REALLY good. So cool. I love airplanes ;D
But wait! Way do your trailing edges on both the elevators and rudder not line up with the tail fairing? I think you need to start the build over ;)
Silly, he's showing scale wear and tear.
Jack
The tail cone was attached last.
I suppose I could have trimmed it shorter, but it would also have changed the profile/shape, so I left it as is.
I don't know... Do you think you'll win the scale award at Kingston with THAT flaw?!!! Especially after I point it out to everyone? ;D
I know who will the target in Kingston for being nobbled!
LOL
Jack.
Quote from: piker on February 05, 2014, 02:33:45 PM
I don't know... Do you think you'll win the scale award at Kingston with THAT flaw?!!! Especially after I point it out to everyone? ;D
We all know your biplane isn't really scale.
I guess you'll be hoping for best sport plane award. ;D
I'm entering my Nooner in the scale contest. It's "true scale" to the original Nooner.
You may have a chance with that one. ;D
So versatile!
Tom
I've witnessed this one flying. Its such a good plane all the people want to do is JUMP OUT IF IT! Watch the videos you will get the idea of how they fly down there! Heck Kirby Chambliss lives right down the road so to speak...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q2hbu4083Sc&feature=youtube_gdata_player (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q2hbu4083Sc&feature=youtube_gdata_player)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ca9IUu_Lgdc&feature=youtube_gdata_player (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ca9IUu_Lgdc&feature=youtube_gdata_player)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i_yushwKIzE&feature=youtube_gdata_player (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i_yushwKIzE&feature=youtube_gdata_player)
Based on a trial balance of all the components, it seems as though a battery pack in the nose (under the cockpit-hatch) will work just fine.
I also tried measuring amp draw with the 3-blade propellers, which happen to look really good (see the image below), on various battery packs.
I tried a 4-cell pack with which I was afraid to go past 1/2 throttle (about 25 amps) because it was really pulling hard and fast.
I then tried a 3-cell pack which only drew 23 amps, but was still incredibly strong.
That only makes about 500 to 550 watts total, (two motors) at full throttle, for a 10 pound (or so) model airplane.
It doesn't seem like much, but it really feels strong, and I think it will be more than enough.
Any comments?
Even with its huge wing area and light weight for its size I would consider trying to run with just one motor and a 4S pack and see what the numbers are. 550W on 10lbs just to me seems low on power. It would be nice to have that little bit extra. Remember this is a converted glow model and might require a fair bit of pitch speed to fly stable. I hope some of the other larger model guys chime in here as Im curious to hear there thoughts. Despite all that it looks great Michael.
Fuselage former horizontal braces removed, and plenty of room for a battery tray.
That battery hatch looks great.
I would go for 100 W/lb, so 1000 Watts tota). You've only got 50w/lb there now. That would have been considered marginal back in the NiCad days.
I started painting.
This will take a while, and there's lots of improvements needed as I make progress.
Anyway, here's a photo, warts and all.
Must be dwarf warts, I can't see any. Looks great to me.
Jack.
Jack's right. We need a high-res photo and a good magnifier so we can find the mini warts.
It's looking fabulous Michael.
Andy
What warts?.... You should see some of my builds
Slight improvements; still working at it.
Still waiting for decals to be delivered.
I'll start the wing in a few days.
Wow! Very nice!
Where are you painting? in the house? I bet Lyn loves THAT :)
Must be "Micro Warts" by now 'cause it looks great to me.
Jack.
Quote from: Papa on February 11, 2014, 10:45:20 AM
Must be "Micro Warts" by now 'cause it looks great to me.
Jack.
There are "warts".
This has been an overly ambitious project for me.
Building a model of this complexity (rounded fuselage with balsa skin, kit built with retracts, flaps and twin-wiring, complete fiberglassing, painting, etc.), on a strict 4-month period, has been challenging.
The final product will be nice, but it will have its flaws.
OK, so how many warts per pound? ;D
75 will make it a sport flyer.
Jack.
Looks truly great Michael. I hope you are very proud.
It was very nice to see the DC3 fuselage at the Pilot's Meeting last night. I was admiring the lines of the fuselage as Michael was talking about the plane. The DC3 really does have nice lines.
It'll be a fantastic model, Michael! But don't rush the build of this magnificent model to make time for a bunch of ARFs. You already have enough ARFs in my opinion ;D
Unless the ARFs are seaplanes. In that case I whole heartedly endorse than endeavour :)
I am sorry that I missed the meeting! I would have liked to see the DC-3 too!
Basic wing colours applied; flaps and ailerons installed; tail-feathers being applied.
Graphics, carefully being applied.
Looking even better!
Jack.
Working on radio and power setup.
Decals applied (they really dress up the model).
Not a wart in sight!
GoodGreat looking model.
Jack.
Now 888 watts static (60 amp draw) at full throttle.
That's with 10/7 contra-rotating 3-blade props.
That looks awesome, Michael. Congratulations.
I'm very pleased for you and very jealous.
Still to do:
1. fix receiver in place.
2. wire voltage regulator to battery connector; plug into receiver.
3. put a latch or other hold-down mechanism on cockpit/battery hatch.
4. balance.
5. secure prop adapters with thread-lock.
6. more finishing touches: panes lines and other details.
Model weighs under 9 pounds with a 4-cell 4000mah battery pack (that's less than I was expecting. I'm please with that).
However, I'll probably need a 4-cell 5000mah battery pack to balance the plane without useless added weight, or I can use a separate 2-cell battery for the voltage regulator.
Comments? Advice?
Beautiful Michael.
Skis? Winter maiden on the new "Snow-Tex" runway? . Seem such a shame to keep it hangared till June when the field dries up!
Complimentary photographic coverage! :D
Andy
Use the two cell and you will have flexibility for fine tuning the balance.
Jack.
Separate RX power with regulator or LiFe gets my vote. Much more reliable than esc based bec's and if you ever did have main battery troubles you could still fly it. Ive been using the 10C LiFe pack for over a year in my Enigma and its been flawless.
http://www3.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin/wti0001p?&I=LXDVCA&P=6 (http://www3.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin/wti0001p?&I=LXDVCA&P=6)
That's the one im using but you could use something even larger if desired.
The model looks absolutely beautiful in that rear quarter photo Michael. That extra work to make the scale style tail is a nice touch.
The DC3 is looking really great! The finishing details have come together fast! Great work!
BTW, I'm going with a separate BEC run from the main power battery on all my large planes now. I just like the idea of eliminating a separate RX pack and the need to make sure it's charged and maintained well. I've always considered the Rx pack to be the weakest link in my in-flight system. And if you need CG adjustment, it'll be much more effective if you move the main pack a bit... assuming you have the adjustment space.
Why do you consider it the weakest link?
More from the old days of Ni-cads where I would always wonder about the charge state and the general condition of these little packs that we tend to forget about, charge every once in a while, or worse, every time we go flying, so there's that ol' memory concern, and I certainly wouldn't cycle them.
Compare that to our power packs that get all sorts of exercise to keep them healthy, lots of very detailed attention, and a good peak charge before every flight. We are much more likely to notice a drop in performance of a power pack, as it ages, then a separate Rx pack where we won't know if it's in trouble until the plane it's in crashes. Also, even a really tired old flight pack will probably have enough in reserve to power the Rx, long after there isn't enough power to fly any more. You'd have to REALLY drain the flight pack down before you lose Rx power. When you power your Rx with the power pack, you're literally putting a freshly peaked battery in the plane for every flight, and, you also never have to worry about forgetting to charge the separate pack.
That's how I look at it.
You can get Rx pack voltage displays though. Would that not help reduce risk to acceptable levels?
LiFe receiver packs solve lots of failure points. No memory, low storage drain, high capacity, 6Volt output eliminates external regulator and gives strong servos. Nicads what's a nicad Robert? Another advantage is very safe setup. Rx power is independent and if using it only the motor can never start. Also you can power up the model motor battery and until you power the receiver the esc will remain unarmed.
Thanks for the photos, Andy.
The maiden/test flight was a success. The plane flew nicely, and felt 'lighter' in the air than expected.
The landing was excellent and smooth.
I did bend knock the retracts in a bit when taxiing after the flight, but the repair is easy.
That second photo is great!
I was watching the preparations but looked away and when I looked up you were flying it as if it was old hat. Congratulations on a great build thread finish!
Michael, that plane looks absolutely awesome in the air! (and in your hands) Following your build has been really inspirational to me in my attempt at the waterbomber.
Colin
Yes! I forgot to congratulate you on your accomplishments with this plane specifically. Great build thread, great inspirations, and a perfect test flight. I'm so glad I was there to witness it!
Great work, Michael!!!!
I'm looking forward to having the DC3 as part of the TEMAC sky-scape :)
Some of you may know, I crashed my DC3 due to a radio problem.
http://temac.ca/smf/index.php/topic,5289.0.html
Horizon Hobby has been pretty good to me; they fixed my radio and compensated me fairly, but my model is still pretty broken.
Well, today the repairs have begun! I'm starting with the fuselage and I expect this will take about 1 or 2 weeks. The wing looks pretty bad, but I'll deal with that later. The retracts are badly damaged, and I'll have to order new ones.
That's the spirit, Michael. Putting all the skills he learned at the scratch building class to good use. LOL.
Jack.
2 hours of work done.
Another day will be sanding, filling, more sanding, fiberglass, apply water-based poly-urethane, and paint, and trim.
Deja-vu.
Fuselage has been sanded and smeared with filler. When it's dry, I'll sand it.
The wing is a mess. I'm trying to open it up to examine the damage. One I get it sorted out, I'll slowly start re-gluing and re-enforcing. The landing gear is a mess, and it won't come out. I'll keep trying.
Keep at it Mike, that model is worth it.
Colin
It's a beautiful plane Michael. You can do it. Like Colin said, it's worth it.
I was going to fly with Glenn this evening, but he cancelled due to the humidity, and would work on his Lysander instead.
So I decided to continue on my DC3.
The nose has been sanded, filled, re-sanded, and now I've started applying fiberglass.
I have finally got the damaged retracts out, cut away much of the center sheeting, and cut damaged scrap enough that the wing will be able to be braced and glued back in shape. I'll have to buy more glue before I can continue, but I'm confident enough now to order new retracts and 3-blade props.
Congratulations Michael. Inspiration to us all.
Speedy is at it again.
Great looking work Michael.
Keep at it, it will fly much better when it's finished.
Jack.
Looking good. Keep at it!
Fuselage ready for painting.
Wing dihedral reset.
Wing substructure repaired, strengthened and bolstered.
Retracts and new props ordered; approx. $300.
A bit more progress.
I can't do much more on the wing until I install the new retracts, which arrive next weekend.
Maybe I'll paint the fuselage this week.
Top of the wing.
Boy even for you that is fast.
You must be enjoying it.
Jack.
Fuselage done. Not as nice as when new, but it'll look just fine when flying in the air.
Congratulations!
Retracts purchased and installation in progress.
Where are those for sale Mike?
Colin
They are made by Robart, and I had A+Js order them for me.
http://robart.com/products/top-flite-dc-3-pneumatic-main-retracts
Thanks Mike ... Awesome repair by the way.
Colin
Great test flight this evening Michael. I am sure it will fly better with two props!
Two things are for sure: we both would have panicked if we knew one prop was missing; and, 2) We would have been in significant trouble if you would have deployed flaps.
Sure a case of "ignorance is bliss"
Frank
ps: for those of you who did not see it, there was a noise at about 25' altitude after take-off and something flew off. We all thought it was a hatch or a cowl. No-one realized the starboard prop was missing until just before touchdown.
Hmmm ... so it flew on one motor without noticeably affecting the flight characteristics?
Colin
I'm waiting for Jack to issue a 'Tickler'.
After that, I'll post about the flight.
As Frank mentioned, I re-maidened my DC3, after extensive repairs, which included putting on new propellers.
Frank, Glenn and Greg C all stood by to help me in case I needed help.
The plane taxied well, but upon increased throttle, the model veered right. (see photo below). I wasn't sure what happened but I corrected the direction and took off. After only a few seconds it sounded like something broke loose and we saw something fall. We thought it might be a battery hatch or a damaged nacelle cowl; we weren't sure.
Frank immediately suggested landing, but the plane was actually flying nicely so I decided to keep flying. It did need some trim here and there, and it did seem a little slower than I remembered, but it was really flying well!
I kept flying and even did a couple lower passes, where it became evident that nothing from the structure of the plane was missing.
After a few more circuits, I prepared to land. As the plane slowed it was apparent that a propeller was missing!
Frank is right that I might have been more nervous and not handled it well had I been aware, but as it is, the model is well engineered, and flies quite well on one motor.
The repair is minor, and I will use a bit of 'locktite' on the prop adapter.
I'm really happy that the plane is now flyable, and I look forward to another season of enjoyment with it.
The photo (from after the flight) below shows a prop missing on one side, and the hole it made in the fuselage.
That's amazing that it would fly so well on one prop (when it was designed for two) that you didn't even really notice it! Congrats!
Colin
The model was designed to fly safely with glow (internal combustion) engines, which fail much more often than electric motors.
To deal with this situation, the model is designed with considerable outward thrust on both motors, which helps a lot in this type of situation.
Repair from the lost prop is almost done.
In the photo you can see where the hole was carefully filled with balsa, which was then sanded smooth, filled with filler and sanded, and then given one layer of fiberglass with water-based poly-urethane.
I'll paint it when it dries.