I picked up a short kit off of RC Canada A couple of weeks back. I thought long and hard about this because beauty is what this is lacking big time. However, knowing that hundreds were constructed during the war in Canada as well as Britain and the fact that it did everything from training to target tow to STOL landings behind enemy lines to drop off spies, I was convinced that I had to build it. There are some brilliant You Tube videos showing it's abilities from pre WW2 to current flights from Hamilton as the Warplane Heritage Museum is also an owner of a restored example which currently flies.
Here are a few shots I have taken. Construction began on Sunday and is coming along pretty good.
What a fabulous subject Glenn. This will be awesome! Good for you.
My Dad was an RCAF mechanic in WWII. He worked on many Lysanders and spoke of them with fondness. I've always wanted one ... Great find, Glenn!
Great, what kit and specs?
Jack.
Thanks Guys, I hope it turns out well. There are just a massive number of parts provided. It probably represented two solid weeks of work transferring and cutting formers, ribs and the landing gear from balsa and plywood.
Jack, The Lysander is a Dennis Bryant plan. The aircraft will have an 81" wingspan, sit about 18" high when complete and be somewhat hefty as I am using all of the pre cut parts (although some will be lightened somewhat for ventilation and of course weight savings) I suspect the Lysander will be 8 to 10 pounds given the short nose, and heavy plywood landing gear and spats. Balancing will probably require lots of lead given past experience with the Sopwith Pup.
The Lysander is roughly the size of the Page SuperCub which Michael is currently working on.
The Canadian Warplane Heritage Museum in Hamilton has one. Here is a link to information pertaining to it. A great looking aircraft and project. http://www.warplane.com/vintage-aircraft-collection/aircraft-history.aspx?aircraftId=37 (http://www.warplane.com/vintage-aircraft-collection/aircraft-history.aspx?aircraftId=37)
"I thought long and hard about this because beauty is what this is lacking big time."
Glenn, IMHO, the Lysander's adherence to "function dictates form" creates beauty for anyone who appreciates and tries to understand functional design. I think that's why you chose it and you are unknowingly in love with Westland's ugly duckling!
Nice choice! Looking forward to seeing it fly!
Glen, I think that's one cool looking bird! It's "bulldog beauty". lol! Saw this video online ... man it sure does look sharp. Yours will be one of a kind for sure ... don't see a lot of these at RC flying fields I imagine. (I certainly have never seen this one modeled.) Great choice!
Colin
https://youtu.be/FBxV1bG96Oo
Thanks Colin,
I'm Leaning towards that very colour scheme. lol.
Here is where I'm at.
Well, she is a complicated build, but I'm happy to say that I am making progress. I'm still looking at the best place to locate the batteries, but have solved the motor and standoff issues.
Here are some new photos.
The tail is now roughed in to place which allows me to start on the wings...yay!
Do the wings have that funny crank built in or did they design it out.
Jack.
Hi Jack,
The funny gull wing shape is there. I fortunately have two drawings for the wing. The right wing is basically a total mirror image copy of the left wing, (complete with reversed lettering) that is okay though as I'm keeping the legible drawing for reference. I spent a good length of time yesterday separating and bagging the wing ribs and assorted parts for each wing half. I hope to start construction today. The fuselage and tail feathers can now be put off to the side for a while I figure a few things out.
Hey Glenn! That looks awesome! Very nicely built, and an interesting shape and structure. So cool.
Thanks Rob,
This is a very rewarding and fun build. As mentioned above, I am holding off on stringer details and balsa cladding on the fuselage and instead now concentrating on the wing. It is a complicated wing which I want to make sure gets built right. After that is complete and I feel that the wing and fuselage are mated together correctly, I 'll return to the fuselage.
This is such a great model subject. I can't wait to see it!
Thanks Andre
I'm currently working through the drawings, trimming ribs and making sure I thoroughly understand what the designer was wanting built.
I've laid out the right wing as it is a reverse copy the left wing drawing (and I mean reverse) .
The biggest thing to slow me down is the wing ribs, however, I have now pretty much completed them and have started gluing to the spars. This is where it starts to get exciting as it is now starts to take shape.
I picked up a set of fiberglass wheel pants that I swear are from or for a
Lysander. They appear to be a little small, but given the fact that they were sold to me for Five bucks, I thought it was worth the gamble. I will probably still carve from balsa, but having a 3d model will help me to get them right.
Well guys, I'm still plugging away at the Lysander. The wing ribs were all rough cut and required sizing and and fitting, furthermore, the ribs shown on the drawings did not perfectly line up with the wing plan. But I have experienced this many times as I'm sure many of you have also. I made adjustments during construction and have been able to get the main wing structure complete enough to take a couple of photos of the process so far.
Glenn
Nice picture back there of John Lennon at the Rolling Stones Rock and Roll Circus.
Oh yeah, the plane is really cool, too!
Looking fabulous Glenn
Thanks guys!
I was wondering if anyone would spot John.
Nice going Michael. Bonus points for the names of the other two visible (slightly) musicians. lol
Eric Clapton and Keith Richards!
Well done Simon!
What song were they playing? ;D
Yer Blues!
Good call Simon and great song!
Any way it has been a while. Last week I was off and I used the time to kick start the project. It's a good thing too as just building the ailerons and flaps took better part of three days. Between sizing, gluing, sheeting and hinging, oh yeah sanding I managed to get the wing looking like a complete unit.
Next step was the landing gear. I missed placing a shim which meant either breaking the glue joint or altering all of the associated wood. I broke the glue joint.
All in all, I am quite happy how the aircraft is shaping up and even managed to get the most of the stringers on the fuselage.
Glenn
Meticulous work Glenn. Very nice.
Thank you sir. :P
Just to let you know that the project is still moving forward. 1) I have added oleo struts to the heavy plywood gear as I definitely prefer an aircraft to have a damping system and the plans only had a fixed axle relying on soft tires to reduce the impact loads. 2) the cowling has been started and by using original formers designed for the gas variant and a lot of cutting and trimming, I have been able to get a reasonable cowling which once adorned with blisters and cowl flaps not to mention a proper lip should look quite passable. 3) the vertical fin and rudder are ready for final sanding. 4) the horizontal stabilizer and elevators are pretty much sanded, although complications arise with this because of the hidden hinges. I will have to cover the elevators first, then attach to the horizontal stabilizer and finally sheet the underside of the stabilizer to complete. I am thinking this through before committing. 5) the wheel pants have been every bit as complicated as I had expected. The precut formers are glued to the landing gear ply, then the inner fender ( I used 1/64th ply) is put in place on the back side. After that, a series of large balsa blocks were glued to the formers. then comes the carving and sanding....yikes!
Any ways , here are a few photo's..enjoy!
Here are another couple showing the blocks of balsa being cut and shaped.
Glenn
Awesome, Glenn!
Do you think we'll see her fly this year? No need to rush on a wonderful plane like that!
Hey guys,
After a couple of weeks of carving and sanding I decided to assemble the parts of the aircraft to get a feeling as to how it was shaping up. I am pretty happy with the results so far. I've noticed that this is going to be the first aircraft I have owned which is going to extremely nose heavy. May have to rethink the battery location.
Glenn
Front view.
Glenn that looks amazing! I especially like how the strut fairings and the wheel pants are coming along. Can't wait to see this one at the field.
Colin
That build looks fantastic! And you're doing a great job, Glenn!
Ever wonder why Glenn seems to be progressing so well with this awesome build? I found out why!
Busted! My basement is actually a RC model sweat shop.... . back to work!!! ;D
BTW, great photo, where did you find that?
On the Seagull model Facebook page!
Woh.. Nice.. Do u know how much it is doing to weight when it is completed?
Hi Tuck,
I'm not really sure what to expect right now, I think 10 pounds would probably be about right. Anything lower would be a bonus.
Glenn
It has been a long time, but the project is still moving forward. Unfortunately build time has been replaced by repair time. But the Blue nose Mustang is back in the air with a redone wing.
As for the Lysander, the horizontal stabilizer and elevator are in place, tail wheel installed, servos buried in the fuselage, wheel pants shaped, the main wing is fairly complete and the vertical fin and rudder are covered. The elevator was the trick though, I could not get it to work according to the plans, so I modified the linkages and ended up with a solution which has provided balanced and accurate contol...I hope.
Here are a couple of pictures.
Here are another couple.
Man I was so excited, I thought you were going to say it's ready for the fun fly on Sunday! ;)
Well, I swear it is getting closer to being flight ready, but it is a slow process as we all know. I'm not going to have it ready for this weekend which is probably just as well given the wind, but I should have the covering done tomorrow. I may have the radio installation complete tomorrow as well.
Here are a few shots of the fuselage in various stages of assembly.
nice Glenn!
I am pleased to report that the windy weekend has been put to good use. I have completed covering the fuselage and have been working on the wing struts which are the last major components of this build. I also stumbled upon some RAF markings which I believe I bought in Kingston either this year or last. Regardless, I could not help myself, I placed the decals on and this is the result. :)
Wow!
Best use of a windy weekend I have ever seen. Congratulations Glenn!
Thanks guys,
It feels good knowing the "to do" list is shrinking.. Phew!
Wow! Very nice, Glenn. Lookin' GOOD!!!
Way to go Glenn, in true 'Moon Plane' livery!
What is the wingspan? It looks huge in the photo!
Thanks guys,
Roger, I think the wing span is 84", The plane will be roughly the size of my Page Super Cub. It has a very torquey G160 motor with a 6s battery swinging a 3 blade 16" x 10" prop. I was concerned that this may be too little as it is a 245 kv motor, but after testing in the back yard, I'm convinced the power will be more than adequate with a very scale flight envelope.
Glenn
Well I was hoping to test fly the Lysander yesterday, but the wind was a little too strong and gusty, I did however take it out side and fired up the motor. I found that the motor had lots of power, but there were some timing issues that required attention as the motor would stop abruptly when throttling down. The good news is that the problem has been rectified and we are go for a flight. Tomorrow is my goal... ;D
Here are a few more shots taken yesterday.
Glenn
very cool!!... looking forward top hear about your successful maiden!!
Greg
That looks great Glenn. I can't wait to see it fly.
Quote from: electroflyer on October 26, 2015, 11:59:56 AM
Well I was hoping to test fly the Lysander yesterday, but the wind was a little too strong and gusty
Yeah, I've been waiting three weeks now to maiden the Solent. >:( Anyway, she looks awesome. Specially like the contrast between the glossy and the flat. Adds another dimension to the look. That canopy looks like it was a b*&#h to do though. ;)
Colin
Looks great Glenn. Did you get a chance to maiden it today? I was by the field at about 3 but only a couple of guys there then.
Thanks guys,
Yes Colin, The canopy was a "B" and is not quite finished. I may redo it over the winter, as the plastic I bought was a little too thin.
I did not fly today, but will try tomorrow (weather permitting)
The aircraft is quite portly and required a huge amount of lead to balance despite the big motor and heavy landing gear. The large prop has a lot of thrust though and I'm hoping it will over come anything that gravity can through at it.
Glenn
Home run, Glenn!
Can't wait to photograph it at TEMAC.
Bravo!
Andy
Thank you Andy!!
Good news, the Lysander flew...barely :o. The aircraft is a STOL type however mine barely lumbered in to the air. It required flaps and slats to remain deployed the entire time as I had very little elevator control. I quickly made a decision to land as I soon realized that I had full throttle for pretty much the entire flight. Surprisingly, the plane landed hot but pretty smooth......phew!
After checking the drawings and the C of g, I am beyond convinced that the location is beyond wrong. I am therefore balancing this aircraft in a more conventional way. 25 to 30%. This meant removing almost 20 ounces of nose weight which was required to make the plan c of g.
I sort of think things will improve dramatically with next flight and I hope to try again Sunday...fingers crossed.
Glenn
It's still a flight, and it's still a successful landing. Congratulations!
2 things to consider:
1. Are you drawing enough amps/watts? If you're not, a bigger prop may help a lot with the power issue. If you are drawing enough power, ignore this.
2. Remove 20 ounces? That seems like a lot. Maybe proceed more cautiously; you don't want to be tail heavy.
Any body else? Am Are my comments wrong?
Wow Glenn, the plane looks fantastic! It's a good thing that you landing it safely. Best of luck on the next flight. The weather this week looks good! ;D
Congrats! After your tweeks I'm sure it'll fly as good as it looks. :)
Colin
Thanks guys,
It did look cool being all black against a bright blue sky, but unfortunately as you can imagine my focus was avoiding Terra Firma.
Michael, you are right about being careful with altering the weight radically, but after looking at a side view scale drawing, I became convinced that the way I originally envisioned the balance would have been far more reasonable. Basically, I am going to balance ahead of the main spar, near the fuselage and gauge the flight. It is still nose heavy, just not extreme. As for power, it is a Axi type motor 4130 swinging a 15 x 12 prop on 6s.
Glenn,
Sorry I cut the model out of much of the first part of the flight (the cardiac circuit)...took a while to get ahead of it!
Tried to e-mail so you could post the link but the address I have bounced back. Congratulations!
Another impressive build and impressive test -piloting!
http://youtu.be/U4BB4ebD-yw
Certainly not lacking power. :)
Colin
Nice flight. Congratulations!
I'm sure you'll get it dialed in.
Awesome build, Glenn! It looks like it flies very well, but did look nose heavy the way it came in fast for the landing.
Very impressive!!!!!!! Beautiful plane. Well done.
Nice job Glenn
Man does that plane look awesome
Well done
Bravo!!
My heart was in my mouth watching the video. Looks like a handful! Could you give us your observations on the maiden flight?
Andy
Thanks guys for the kind words and encouragement.
Andy, the plane was a handful. I was working the sticks to get the plane aloft and then keep it there. It was severely nose heavy, but that was based on the drawings. My gut feeling was that the drawing had the C of g too far forward, and given the motor, battery location and the heavy landing gear this aircraft should have required almost no nose weight, but to my shock 20 ounces was required to make the position indicated.
It was very strange to have to hold full up elevators the entire flight and full flaps deployed to gain height where I could relax (slightly). I cut the flight short to ensure power on landing and given the fact that the elevator was maxed out, power is what allowed a smooth but hot landing. The plane should be flying like a Cub and I suspect it will once the balance is confirmed and she is properly trimmed. I can hardly wait to try again!
Glenn.
Move over Chuck Yeager...you've met your match as a test pilot! Nice job Glenn!
That first circuit really was a heart stopper....sorry my sloppy work with the iPhone missed a lot of the initial wobbling efforts to climb. Keep us posted about how the taming of the beast goes. We know you'll do it!
Quote from: electroflyer on November 06, 2015, 09:47:28 PM
Thanks guys for the kind words and encouragement.
Andy, the plane was a handful. I was working the sticks to get the plane aloft and then keep it there. It was severely nose heavy, but that was based on the drawings. My gut feeling was that the drawing had the C of g too far forward, and given the motor, battery location and the heavy landing gear this aircraft should have required almost no nose weight, but to my shock 20 ounces was required to make the position indicated.
It was very strange to have to hold full up elevators the entire flight and full flaps deployed to gain height where I could relax (slightly). I cut the flight short to ensure power on landing and given the fact that the elevator was maxed out, power is what allowed a smooth but hot landing. The plane should be flying like a Cub and I suspect it will once the balance is confirmed and she is properly trimmed. I can hardly wait to try again!
Glenn.
How does the C of G on the full-scale plane compare to that indicated on the drawing for the model? Is the model airfoil scale?
Andy
Great job Glenn, build and flying!
Thank you Alan,
I'll try it again Sunday if the weather is good.
Hi Glenn:
Looks like a nice fall day tomorrow. I should be there before 2 pm. Hope to get some great photos of you and the great Lysander. Save some battery for a photo flight.
Cheers.
Andy
cc
@electroflyer
Well it has been a long time between posts, however I am pleased at how the reconstruction has progressed.
The fuselage was basically in three major components with the landing gear also severely damaged. The first step was thinking this through as to how a reconstruction could be quickly and effectively completed while keeping the airframe square and true. The original frame was constructed from quarter inch balsa. I decided to swap this to bass wood. This meant splicing to the rear fuselage which perfectly intact. I made long rails and eased formers into place and only securing with adhesive once everything was looking correct according to the drawings. Here are a few shots from the beginning.
Glenn, good to see you back at the Lysander...we know you'll do a great job on the rebuild. Based on your experiences to date, any planned changes before Lizzie takes off again?
I am certain that with the Bick's Extra Garlic Sandwich Savers everything will turn out just fine!! ;D
Andy
Heck, I knew I should have laid out half a dozen beer....like Bill ;)
The only changes will be to go back to the original plan of doing anti-clockwise prop rotation, windows that roll down in the cockpit, some sort of cockpit detailing and the winglets with dummy bombs or possibly some sort of bomb drop if the plane becomes very comfortable to handle.
Quote from: electroflyer on January 11, 2016, 07:25:34 AM
Heck, I knew I should have laid out half a dozen beer....like Bill ;)
The only changes will be to go back to the original plan of doing anti-clockwise prop rotation, windows that roll down in the cockpit, some sort of cockpit detailing and the winglets with dummy bombs or possibly some sort of bomb drop if the plane becomes very comfortable to handle.
I sure know
that part. I actually took the leap of faith and added a pilot to my Pitts! (Scary!) :o
Andy
Come on Andy, Lets see a photo of your handy work!
Quote from: electroflyer on January 11, 2016, 01:13:33 PM
Come on Andy, Lets see a photo of your handy work!
Actually I went for the minimum handy work possible in order to avoid arousing the wrath of the gravity deities! (A very wise man at TEMAC always says, "Don't make it too pretty!!") I opted for a
stock Hangar 9, 1/7-scale youth-size civilian pilot bust (http://www.hangar-9.com/Products/Default.aspx?ProdID=HAN9113), which is about perfect for the 1:5.5 scale of my model. (I don't know how they figure it to be 1/7 scale.) No enhancements, other than to trim off the base. I even avoided the temptation to light-sand the hair to get rid of that Brylcream gloss, paint over the hair paint on the rims of the headphones (dummies! - he must have been painted late on a Friday afternoon), or put a mic boom on the headset. I can only hope the deities don't think I chose too handsome a pilot to emulate yours truly in the cockpit. ;D
Cheers!
Andy
Looking for Frank's reply!
The pilot figure may look a bit like Desmond Lightbody but I'm having trouble seeing the resemblance to Andy. I think this time, someone other than me may have been into the beer!
At least now, Andy has someone else to blame if anything ever goes wrong with HOFR, ;D
Well, I have just placed this thread on life support and I am charging the paddles....Clear!
Merry Christmas guys!
My Lysander had a bad crash back in the Springtime which left me pondering the feasibility of making it air worthy again or just trash the surviving parts. The plane had crashed into the grove of trees (now known as "Lysander Forest") which is due east of the pitts.
It had crashed on a very windy day, the wind was blowing at least 15-20 kmh from the south. On takeoff the plane was very responsive to power and took off with ease, however, it was not responding to the bank command very easily. This has always been a fault of the aircraft design, construction and covering. I managed to get the plane to turn and was now heading north. Over the trees was where everything went haywire. I tried to bank left to be facing west, the response was painfully slow and then suddenly the wing tip dipped and the spin began, I quickly applied power and managed to save the aircraft, but before I knew it, the plane was back in a spin and this time the lack of altitude meant a collision would occur! With a painful crashing, breaking sound the bits and pieces came to rest.
The rescue party of Dave, Greg H and Frank and Andy helped me to retrieve most of the parts. Surprisingly, the fuselage was more or less intact, the motor and cowl were off and had to be located, the fuse and half a wing had to be removed from a tree. everything was brought back to the car where disassembly for transit happened. I was also able to start the inventory of surviving parts.
After leaving the plane for a couple of days, I pondered buying a whole new wing kit from Sarik hobbies in the UK. Not a week after the crash a brand new laser cut short kit from Sarik came up for sale on RC Canada. I almost purchased it until I realized that I would have to build the whole plane again. The truth is, I had the plans and former sections, so out came the tracing paper and balsa and I rebuilt the broken inboard wing section. That inboard section was joined to the outboard section and the two halves were made into one wing. This was not a quick process, but was rewarding.
I know it is a long winded story, but the aircraft is almost complete now. Here are some pictures to show some of the reconstruction.
Glenn
@electroflyer you are inspirational yet again. Congrats on the resurrection of your magnificent Lysander! It is looking great.
I am going straight down to my cave to work on my Grumman Tracker!!
Thanks for the nudge Glenn!
Andy
You say long winded, I say nicely detailed. So glad to see the progress in pictures. Nicely done!
Well done Glenn. Another amazing feat. No wonder we call you "Great Sage!"
Here is the current status of the plane. Ailerons have been altered to improve control, washout has been added to the tips, only inboard leading edge slats function, tail wheel is now steerable and lights now work on wheel pants using a single switch and main battery as opposed to the separate battery previously required.
Things left to do include place windows back on the airframe, adding a new fiberglass cowl, re-program radio for new functions and finally re-balance the aircraft.done...PHEW!
Thank you guys, really appreciate the kind words.
Cheers!
Can't wait to see this back in the air. One of the most unique planes I've seen. Beautiful.
Hey
@electroflyer,
How many bottles of Coke (photo IMG_20201225_135845) did it take to get this far in this remarkable lightning rehab? I may have to start using the stuff. Do you drink it or use an IV drip? ;D
Andy
The most pressing question: what are we going to change the name of Lysander Forest to?
Quote from: bfeist on December 28, 2020, 04:44:36 PM
The most pressing question: what are we going to change the name of Lysander Forest to?
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How about the "Venus Flight Trap" ?!! ;D
Andy