Well, I completed my First Major Build a Bristol M1C... Just waiting for some decals. Amazing how much money you can dump into a $80 kit. Anyways, it's done!
So, now I must move on to the reason I built this one....
The Fokker DR-1 from Balsa USA 1/4 scale.
I have been reading every forum and comment ever made on this build. I know that the season is starting to wind down and I am assuming that I will be on this kit for the next 3 years.
So I thought that I would start a build thread...
Part 1) Grabbed Box, dusted off and put on table.
OK, that was enough for today.
lol don't get burned our trying to get too much at once
So is the next step studying the instructions for hours, on the loo????? Or is that just me? ;D
I started already... I think a rebuilding a VW bug motor is easier... oh man! ???
With the three wings it looks hard... But I started to clean the bench and get it ready.
I may just build my BUSA SE5A along with you (but I doubt I'd be able to keep up). I have the plans on the board, the wing tip profiles glued up, and all the wood sorted. So I'm winning so far (will probably be the last time :))
Trying to keep up with you would be very motivating. When are you planning to have the DR1 finished?
BTW, I would want to build floats for the SE5a. Floats like this:
http://www.sarsfield.com/OriginalPages/orig_schneider2.html (http://www.sarsfield.com/OriginalPages/orig_schneider2.html)
Robert
Ok, you are on.... I will get the plans put on the bench and some fresh sheeting... It would be neat to have both going at the same time. You have way more experience at this.. I only have two kits under my belt and one was done when I was 12 ish. I just finished the bristol M1C. But last night was a no go until I figure out what is wrong with the radio. :-[
Fresh sheeting? For what? Are you building from scratch?
Thanks for the motivation and a bit of focus. I've had this kit for several years and have been itching to get at it.
Robert
If you can make it for wings, let's start this weekend. :P
Greg
One of the guys in our club (Keswick) has a 1/4 scale Flair Dr.I. He flies it on a 26cc gasser which turns a 20x6 at 5000 rpm. Just the right amount of power. As a comparison the 5320/34 AXI I had turns a 20x10 at 5300 on 30 NiMHs. My 5345/16 turns a 24x15 on 8S3P A123s with similar pitch speed (don't have all the numbers memorized).
Don't know if you have a motor for it or not yet.
Can we assume, based on your new tag line, that a Kemf (or was that Udet?) scheme is in the offing? Martin has been considering a Dr.I for some time. I can't for the life of me remember if he has started but I don't think so. I have quite a few reference books so if you want to 'scale it up' details and scale proportions wise. Also there was an amazing build on RCGroups under the scale electric forum. I think the guys handle is Hammered. He was working on a 1/6 Dr.I based on the AZM kit but way beyond scale. However, too much weight resulted in a poor test flight. Still lots of good info and motivational reading/viewing.
As an aside I just had more awesome service from AXI. Second time he has gone way beyond expectations or even (wouldn't it be nice if..) level of service. No more Chineese for me.
Stephen
I want photographic evidence of your progress guys.
Ok, well I am starting this weekend. I will start posting soon... Robert has a bit of a lead...
Bit of a lead? Are you kidding? I'm about an hour in. You will make that up and pass that with your first sitting.
But, I did a bit of work last night. It was 11:30 and I was planning to head upstairs to call it a night, but decided to take a quick look at the SE5a. Before I knew it, it was after 12:00 and the spars and TE are down and the ribs are ready to go on...for one set of wings ie. lower left and right... the top wing and bottom wing are identical on this plane until hardpoints start going in. I guess that makes thing easier, but a bit boring :-).
Ben, I will take a picture as a wing starts to grow on the building board. Right now there's not much to look at besides the plans and some sticks.
Robert
I will need some help... I was on the looo as simon calls it and I don't understand some of the terminology that BUSA is using...
:o
Like what?
Oh, and remind me to never touch your instruction manual :P
Robert
Ok got through a few pages last night... :P
It was funny and I measured the center mark from wing tip to wing tip and it's 1/8th off on one side? This normal? I had to redraw the side that was longer!
Here is some of the images.. she is big 70 1/2 WS.
They say the plans can distort (shrink/expand), so perhaps one side stretched more than the other. For this reason, they keep saying to use the parts at the primary reference (specifically when spacing out the spars and TE/LE). However, when cutting things to length, the part fit won't help. Good thing you checked, but I wonder how much 1/8" would really effect a plane this size. Lateral weight balance will matter more when done.
I made a bit more progress last night. I have all the ribs and spars / TE in place for one set of wings. But tonight (when I get home at 11:00) I'll work on my Widgeon so I can try that at the lake tomorrow evening.
I can see this thread becoming very long as we're both rather chatty ;D
Robert
Cool. Looks great. BTW, I don't have any LE sheeting on my wings, other than center section. Are those 1/4" ribs I see there?
Robert
They are laminated. So approx 1/4 now. There is a box that needs to be made in plywood with two dowls to hold the wing to the bottom of the fuse.
Oh, I called BUSA and Debbie is sending me new plans.. wow what great customer service!!! A+
Here is the plane that I am going to model it after...
I measured the plans and the spacing around each wing former, they are 3" and the last one is 3 and 1/8th. So the plan was off on one side. The rest is fine, but the tail is also effected being off 1/8th. But the new version is hopefully OK.
Nice. I'm kind of glad you're not making it red :)
Me too! There is too many red ones and lots of other very cool colours
No one seems to want to be the underdog!
Well. I am 80% into the wing. It's looking good. Spent another two hrs on it. I have to glue the l.e and then sheet the top portion of the wing. I should be done the wing this weekend. Hopefully get started on the center wing by monday.
Did you pull an all nighter?! Great work. You'll be done the framing by the beginning of September ;D
Robert
Just talked with the guy in our club with the 1/4 Dr.I. It is a Balsa USA. He has had it for many years so it won't be with the latest updates. It weighed 15 lbs when new and runs a 20x6 prop a 5000 rpm. His is coverall and dope.
Stephen
Lower wing done. Pulled an all nighter. Looks amazing. All sanded. The leading edge was a bit of a challenge. But looks good.
what no pictures :o
I think he's building it, in his head! ;)
Well, from my head to the table! :-\
I got some great sanding blocks in different sizes from PIN. I am using mix of Flexible CA and think (pink) CA from PIN. It works well.
I have lots of sanding to do tonight and I can get started laying out the Mid wing. I am hoping to have it done by the end of the week.
Wednesday I am heading to Seaton Valley, a member there has a DR-1 and he said that I can take a look at it for reference purposes. I am excited. I really would like to see how big this thing is.
Those are beefy looking wing ribs! I love the way wood looks before it's covered.
Hey Greg,
Once you're done with that one I think I've found you your next build. Let me know if you think this thing would fly with an electric motor instead :o
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MjrPgS-t55s&feature=related (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MjrPgS-t55s&feature=related)
No way! This is why I play with model planes.. :'(
I have enough stuff to work on!
Ok, so back to the DR-1.... Sanded the leading edge and the lower wing is now done... What a mess! But looks good!
I have to now lay out the plans for the mid wing. It is a funny process of splicing the plans together to make the mid and upper wing. I am also going to need a sheet of drywall to underlay the plans. The foam is not holding the pins very well.
The process is moving along well... I can get two hrs a night to work on it!
I got stuck with the "honey do" list last night and a "Can we go for a cruise" command. So I could not go to training last night.. ;o( I kept trying to drive by, but got a stern look each time..
But, I did have a few mins to slip out and see "Victor" at the Seaton Fly Club at 4:30. I was told that he had a Balsa USA Triplane that was completed this winter / spring. I didn't have a chance to see it fly, but man he did a great job building it!
He was very helpful and answered lots of my questions. It looks like I might have some issues with battery location on the plane and will have to be creative as the batts needs to sit up the nose for C/G. The overall size was good and can allow me to be creative in other aspects.
He did mention to make the stab adjustable as he had lots of down to keep the plane level in flight. This is a known issue with the kit.
Enjoy the images! Hopefully I can get mine framed up before the winter and can spend the rest of the winter detailing it. I started the center wing, it's moving faster after doing the lower wing. I can't wait to do the fuse... that will be fun!
If you use LiFe batteries you can arrange them in a ring under the cowl.
Jack.
I like the suggestion of the LIFe batteries. I have a bunch of 5S, 4000's that I am going to use. I spoke Dave from PIN and he suggested making a battery box in the nose cone. There is lots of room there and I can make it slip under the cowl and make a small lockable box. I will also add a connector for safety, not sure what it is called, just it cuts the circute so the ESC will not be armed. I am also going to run a sep battery for the ESC to be safe. I might even go with some even bigger batteries. Maybe 2 5S 5000? 10S is going to be overkill like the pup. But I should get some overscale performance if I need it.
I also ordered the two Spandau machine gund and a sound module. ;o)
The 6S A123 pack I have posted for sale would probably fit in that nose nicely :)
Middle wing is moving faster than expected... but getting side tracked with other planes.. lol!
Quote from: Gregor77 on August 24, 2012, 08:36:33 AM
I will also add a connector for safety, not sure what it is called, just it cuts the circute so the ESC will not be armed.
You mean a shunt switch? ;) Good plan ... I use a shunt on all my big planes. Don't want all that power going off on your bodyparts. :o In a plane such as yours (where the packs will be close to the "big blade") it is an absolute necessity IMHO. The cool thing about this setup is that the receiver is powered up and everythng its only your motor that's disabled until you "arm" it. So you can check your control surfaces etc without the plane being armed.
Colin
That is the one.. I was going to make a panel near the pilot to be able to do all that... Thanks for the images.
Lookin' good, Greg.
I'm back in town now and hoping to get back to building, but I do need to do some "flying model" maintanance before the TEMAC FF on the weekend.
What's that sound module you're talking about. Any that's I've seen in the past have added several pounds to the weight of the aircraft. Not worth it in my opinion. Is there a better version now?
Robert
Quote from: wollins on August 27, 2012, 09:37:44 AM
Quote from: Gregor77 on August 24, 2012, 08:36:33 AM
I will also add a connector for safety, not sure what it is called, just it cuts the circute so the ESC will not be armed.
You mean a shunt switch? ;) Good plan ... I use a shunt on all my big planes. Don't want all that power going off on your bodyparts. :o In a plane such as yours (where the packs will be close to the "big blade") it is an absolute necessity IMHO. The cool thing about this setup is that the receiver is powered up and everythng its only your motor that's disabled until you "arm" it. So you can check your control surfaces etc without the plane being armed.
Colin
Colin,
Does that connector just disconnect the positive ESC wire, or is it more complex? Have you ever used bullet-type setup for that that can handle higher current?
Ben
Quote from: bfeist on August 27, 2012, 01:22:16 PM
Quote from: wollins on August 27, 2012, 09:37:44 AM
Quote from: Gregor77 on August 24, 2012, 08:36:33 AM
I will also add a connector for safety, not sure what it is called, just it cuts the circute so the ESC will not be armed.
You mean a shunt switch? ;) Good plan ... I use a shunt on all my big planes. Don't want all that power going off on your bodyparts. :o In a plane such as yours (where the packs will be close to the "big blade") it is an absolute necessity IMHO. The cool thing about this setup is that the receiver is powered up and everythng its only your motor that's disabled until you "arm" it. So you can check your control surfaces etc without the plane being armed.
Colin
Colin,
Does that connector just disconnect the positive ESC wire, or is it more complex? Have you ever used bullet-type setup for that that can handle higher current?
Ben
Ben, If I need a shunt. I usually put a bullet connector on the positive (+ red) wire from the battery to the esc. So far I have never mounted one on the outside. I locate the bullet near a quick access hatch. If the battery plug is close to the quick hatch I won't bother with the shunt.
Chris
Quote from: bfeist on August 27, 2012, 01:22:16 PM
Quote from: wollins on August 27, 2012, 09:37:44 AM
Quote from: Gregor77 on August 24, 2012, 08:36:33 AM
I will also add a connector for safety, not sure what it is called, just it cuts the circute so the ESC will not be armed.
You mean a shunt switch? ;) Good plan ... I use a shunt on all my big planes. Don't want all that power going off on your bodyparts. :o In a plane such as yours (where the packs will be close to the "big blade") it is an absolute necessity IMHO. The cool thing about this setup is that the receiver is powered up and everythng its only your motor that's disabled until you "arm" it. So you can check your control surfaces etc without the plane being armed.
Colin
Colin,
Does that connector just disconnect the positive ESC wire, or is it more complex? Have you ever used bullet-type setup for that that can handle higher current?
Ben
Ben it
is as simple as that. Like Chris my "break" in the circuit is on the positive battery lead of the esc. However I connect my BEC before the "break" so that this way when I connect my pack it powers my receiver (via my BEC) but not the motor so that I can check control surfaces etc without arming the business end. No I haven't used bullets in this situation (or any other for that matter) as I really like Sermos and I use their higher amp ones.
Colin
Due to the weather last night, I kept going on the mid wing.
Just going to side track a bit...
Rigging. I have a plane that is rather semi scale and due to the round built up fuse, I have to take the wing off to install the battery. It also has lots of rigging. I was using thin metal wire. Is there something that I can build that I can un-hook the wires to take the wing off when needed? I was thinking of some Sulivan parts and a hook method. All the wires are metal and someone "Jack" said to get some bungee type wire from Michaels. But it doesn't look right... ;o(
I just wish my decals would show up before the event!
What can I use or where can I get very thin aluminum sheeting? I need to make the side panels for the engine compartment. :D
I got back to building this one after getting an N28c. I am 80% into the mid wing. I just have to do the tips and sand the leading edge.
The N28C on another note needs the fuse built. So not too bad overall.
Both planes will be electric.
Well, I was not feeling to well last night, so I went back in the basement and almost finished the mid wing. I just need to make the wing tips and sand the LE. Then it is time to start the top wing, which seems to be more work with the alierons. ::)
Hey what are you guys using for wood filler? I have some wood filler, but it looks like drywall filler if I look online? I have to make some area's flat and there is a bit of a wave to the wood. I don't want to block sand the wood down. I would rather fill the low spot and sand it flat.
i use the super light pre-mixed poly filla...
Great, I have some of that stuff at home.. I am not trying to re-form a wing.. So anything will be light enough as 90% will be sanded off.
Oh can't wait to get home and start sanding the L.E. I do find this fun and stressfull at the same time. Knowing if I sand too much I will mess it up!
Ok, finished the wing tips.. They seemed very weak and I might have to add some small supports to double them up. Flying the DR-1 is a bit tricky and I don't want to ground loop and smash the wing tips..
I would have to say that I enjoy working with balsa. It is a very forgiving media.
Greg
How about your next project? We could build them together. How about a couple of planes from Jasta 5? I'm thinking Baumer's Edilweiss, Mai's crescent and star, or Fleisher's mailed fist or dragon.
Stephen
http://www.ebay.com/itm/PROCTOR-1917-ALBATROS-DVa-88-MUSEUM-QUALITY-R-C-MODEL-BIPE-KIT-AIRPLANE-/261105081077?pt=Radio_Control_Vehicles&hash=item3ccb135af5 (http://www.ebay.com/itm/PROCTOR-1917-ALBATROS-DVa-88-MUSEUM-QUALITY-R-C-MODEL-BIPE-KIT-AIRPLANE-/261105081077?pt=Radio_Control_Vehicles&hash=item3ccb135af5)
Wow... not at $400+++ at current bid! :o
I have been working hard on the top wing. Funny I added the leading edge Sheeting and the wing bandannas on me. I am now upset and have tried 10 things to get the 77" wing straight again. I have now tried to steam it and add weight on the flat table. Hitting it with heat also.
I seem to remember something about soaking sheeting with ammonia weighting it down and letting it dry. I bet the smell would help you forget if anything! I will try to find more information
I used Windex and tape on the P-40. I would spray the under side with Windex, tape it in place, and let it dry over night.
How the heck did you warp the wing while sheeting? Did you glue the sheeting on while the wing was on the board or while holding in your hands?
I was used thick ca and pushing down on the wing and holding the sheeting I must have pushed to hard. Two days of soaking in windex and heat gun. The win is looking normal again. I have put weights on the wing and let it sit for two days. Pain in the rear. At least I framed up the Algerians.
I'm glad to hear it's coming back into shape. That would be a real drag if it was messed up for good. :o
Robert
I was very frustrated with the wing warping on me... I checked this morning at 5 am and i's back to normal again after a heavy load of weight and windex applications.
I got the alierions completed and framed up this weekend. I have some sanding of the T.E and L.E of the control surfaces now. Then I can cap the top of the Alierions and final sand the shape. Even when I get frustrated, I have to tell my self, Robert Quote, "It's the fun of the build". I just want to get the framing done.. I have to keep slowing down.
I think once the top wing is done, the fun really starts. The fuse.
I have a feeling that the wing mounts are going to kill me.. They look difficult and I am scared to drill holes. Guess I just have to keep measuring over and over again.
Working with woof is fun and at least if you make a mistake, no one will ever know.
Yea my dog never tells anyone anything.... Glad you got the warping sorted out.
Its the autocorrect on Iphones.. Woof? It was supposed to be "Wood".
Quote from: Gregor77 on October 18, 2012, 10:56:22 AM
Its the autocorrect on Iphones.. Woof? It was supposed to be "Wood".
Oh I figured but what fun would there be if I let it slide?
So he WASN'T talking about his dog, but rather his anatomy??? :o
I'm confused. Building model airplane never used to be this complicated...
Piker
Of course you're confused it's all that wood.
But never mind it's all in your head.
Jack.
Well due to the weather and the fact that I had the wing kind of sorted out... It's still twisting a bit, but I think the covering will pull it a bit. I finished off the alerions and started to fine sand the rest of the wing. I am excited that now I can start on the fuse.
I started on the fuse... didn't get far.. Just put some of the longerons on and got the plans all sorted out on the work table. Basically just got to part one of the use as I had to laminate a bunch of pieces together.
With the weather as it is.. limits any VW activity, so it's off to the basement again!
Ok, so I started the one side of the fuse.. Went together well...
Question to the builders. How to I cut the pieces of 1/4 for the frame of the plane straight and get the right angles for the fuse? I was using a piece of wood that was straight and making small marks where the cuts should be and trying to cut straight down. I have a small alloy cutting jig, but only cuts at 90 deg and 45 deg. Is there something else that can help? I was thinking of making an L bracket that could fit against the 1/4 wood and the piece that is already layed down. I could make my marks and then cut it after.
It's just that I want a perfect cut.
Quote from: Gregor77 on October 24, 2012, 08:31:42 AM
Ok, so I started the one side of the fuse.. Went together well...
Question to the builders. How to I cut the pieces of 1/4 for the frame of the plane straight and get the right angles for the fuse? I was using a piece of wood that was straight and making small marks where the cuts should be and trying to cut straight down. I have a small alloy cutting jig, but only cuts at 90 deg and 45 deg. Is there something else that can help? I was thinking of making an L bracket that could fit against the 1/4 wood and the piece that is already layed down. I could make my marks and then cut it after.
It's just that I want a perfect cut.
I always use a hand-held balsa saw and cut freehand. I cut 1/8" or so ahead of the mark and then use a table-top sander like the one that Rob recommended to sand the cut back to the mark while test-fitting along the way. Super quick. I'm no expert builder though, I'm sure others have better tips than this.
Two fuse sides are done now... I have to now change the plans to the top view. I am going to start to put the center formers in place. The bench sander was much faster and easier.. thanks!
It's nice to finally see a bit of a plane showing up now.
Hey! You're supposed to take three years to build that plane! Slow down and let me ctach up >:(
I have to keep going... I just got an N17... One of them is going to have to get done before X-mas... I just spent $200 on parts for the plane! eeee... covering is expensive in silver! :P
Well I had an hr ot two when the little monsters stopping ringing the door bell last night. I boxed up the fuse and it went well till I noticed I grabbed the filler CA instead of the thick CA. But not a big deal.. Just took a long time to set on the plywood. It's nice to see a fuse...
Fuse is now 90% done. Need to cut some ply and glue. What glue are you using for ply?
i use 30 min epoxy
I use CA for everything.
I use a mix of ca and flexible ca and wood glue. Depending on what is required on the build.
I was lacking some images... here you go boys!
The fuse was exciting... I hate making wings and having nothing in the middle!
My next steps are to mount the mid wing and make sure it is level and centered. The rest of the wings will match to this one...
I will be honest.. I am a bit scared. I have to then glue it all.
Once the mid wing is done.. I have to mount the lower one and then make the supports for the upper wing.
Saaawwweeet! ;D
Looking great, Greg. That sheeted tutle decking looks so nice. I'm looking forward to that stage in my construction too.
Robert
I have to figure out how to make a cockpit. I might build the pilot first out of foam. Size him up and build around him.
Oh man, these WWI planes are going to be AWESOME!
The next step of my build is to line up the center wing to the fuse. The instructions say this is the "key" I will be honest, I am a bit scared that I don't mess this part up. Once the mid wing is mounted, I have to start working on the wing supports. It's nice to see it coming together. Electrics are all ordered and all the accessories are hanging on the wall. 2 Williams Spandau machine guns, Large Dubro vintage wheels, and much more.
Hey Greg!! Any update for non Facebook users?
I've been waiting to see this thread start rolling again... ;D
I am having issues putting images on the site from my I-Phone.. .Facebook is the only way I can post images right now.
I have started building the outter struts, tonight I am going to add the attachment points. I have to then box them. I am nervous to make it all straight and true!
After seeing all the other planes going together so well and some getting finished. I started back on the dr-1. Just too many planes to keep working on. So I completed the stab and I am 50% into the tail. Next I need to build the attachment points and make an adjustable stab as the incident is not right from factory. The plane will fly level with too much down.
Nice job on getting back to it, Greg! Good luck.
I kept hammering away. Tail done and attachment points built. Just need to block sand and round the tail. This weekend I will level out the tail and hopefully start on the landing gear.
I have a question in regards to re-inforcing the tail post. The instructions are stating to use a mix of thin and thick CA. I might be better off to do this and add some thin finerglass and epoxy around the tube also and wrap it around the rear of the fuse.
Otherwise I read the instructions about 40 times last night while listening to China's version of American Idol. Thank God for You-tube and all the great RC video's.
I think that once the plane is framed up, I am going to add some gussets to the fuse in some key area's. Even sanding the round edges, some parts broke off. Starting to wonder about the flexible CA and maybe staying with Thick CA for some of the more durable parts. Ribs and Stuff are OK, but frame rails, maybe not.
Thanks again for the motivation and I will keep going on this... I don't want to be last at the field on this one...
I'm really glad to hear you're back at it. We need pictures!
After the swap meet this weekend. I had a chance to spend some more time on the DR-1 I levelled out the rear stab and squared off the tail. Mounted the rear tail post and added some fine fiber cloth to make sure it doesn't come off. Dry fitted the elevator and kept sanding a bit more. It is starting to look more like a plane now. This thing is huge and sure enough, it fell off the stand. I was not impressed with that and will have to thing of another way to move this thing around. It is getting a bit too big and I am not done yet! :o
The next step in the instructions are to make the landing gear. Where can I get some thin copper wire as per the instructions? Do you think Michael's will have that? I might head out at lunch and pick some up!
unguarded construction sites are a great place to look ;)
if you don't feel like getting in trouble with the law... just head to home depot and get a foot or two of stranded copper wire.
Michael's has thin copper wire in their jewelry section.
I used copper wire that I got at Home Depot. They have coils of copper and aluminum in the aisle where the weather stripping is. It's a bit thicker than I would normally use, but I figured it was fine/appropriate for 1/4 scale. Next time I'll see what Michaels, etc. has too.
Robert
Great, I am going to head there afterwork.. lunch was a bit busy at the office...
WW1 Fighter Dogfight - 3 S.E.5as vs 3 Dr.1s (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zh-gsi2tYpE#ws)
World War 1 Fighter Aircraft Dogfighting (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FxXLt-D_jqI#ws)
Very nice. i wonder if we'll be able to have a similar fly around at TEMAC this year... :)
So I started to solder my landing gear and that turned out to be a disaster.. The metal turned black and the solder just dripped off everything. The cooper wire did nothing but held the wires together. I then tried to add some load on the parts and it all snapped off. How much heat do I need to use... I was using a torch.
So after 2 hrs wasted trying to do this.. I just mig welded the parts together... Now it will never come off.
Started working on the lower wing between the landing gear. Just have to shape the leading edge and make the end caps and that will be done.
Then I can start lining up the Motor (Which got used in my 1/4 pup), so I have to wait for more stuff from the king.
This plane is huge!
I was debating on the colour of the solartex and it looks like I will go with the light blue. All the reference images show that the plane had a dark green streak pattern on the upper surfaces. Because I am doing the Voss plane, I will have to also do a semi-gloss finish as the report from McCudden said the plane was fairly shiney in that last battle for Voss.
Don't forget also, Greg, that the most successful WW1 pilots had shiny planes - it was part of the psychological warfare tactics. That and wearing hockey masks.
S
"I just mig welded the parts together"
lol
Did you use acid flux on the gear?
Yes, I used acid flux, it just burned my eyes and made the house smell funny. :-[
Then you need more heat... or more patience. I use an 80 watt iron. No problem.
Quote from: Gregor77 on March 11, 2013, 09:42:21 AM
Yes, I used acid flux, it just burned my eyes and made the house smell funny. :-[
Did you laugh?
Sounds like you directed the torch at the joint. You burned the flux and the residue will not take solder. When you use a torch you have to direct it at the metal above or below the joint. When the flux starts to bubble it should be approaching the right temperature and you can start applying solder.
Jack.
Oh, I missed that "using a torch" bit. Hmmm... I've never used a torch except for soldering copper supply plumbing. I would agree with Jack. Keep the flame away from the joint.
Had lots of time last night to work on the sub wing in the middle of the landing gear. It went together well.
Just wanted to add some updated images.
I am taking Friday off to get the plane ready for covering. I might do a few small pieces to start off with.
Nice! I'm glad it's still moving along.
What's the dealine? Warbird day? May 26?
Sounds a long way off, but there will be distractions for both of us with Spring flying season approaching fast...
That is kind of the target I had in mind. Gordon and Michael are done their planes, so really it is us left. I don't want to be last man standing.
Considering the fact that McCudden (SE5a) and Voss both (F1. Dr1) both fought with the same planes adds a bit of a cool factor! But that happened in Sept 23, 1917.
After shooting down a No. 57 Squadron DH 4 bomber on 23 September, Voss went out on a further patrol and was engaged by six Royal Aircraft Factory S.E.5s of the elite 56 Squadron. In one of the most remarkable encounters in aerial history, Voss fought a single-handed dogfight against several aces: Capt. James McCudden, Lt. Richard Maybery Lt. Geoffrey Hilton Bowman, Capt. Reginald Hoidge, Lt. Arthur Rhys Davids.[3] Keith Muspratt and Lt V.P. Cronyn, with Lt. Harold A. Hamersley and Lt. Robert L. Chidlaw-Roberts of 60 Squadron.[4] The dogfight developed over Poelkapelle. Another German ace, Carl Menckhoff, attempted to assist Voss but was downed by Rhys-Davids, (though surviving).[5] Voss fought the RFC aces for just 10 minutes, eluding them and achieving hits on nearly every S.E.5.[3]
Using the triplane's superior rate of climb and its ability to slip turn (using the rudder to turn quickly), Voss managed to evade his opponents. He was able to turn at high speeds and attack those behind him. After flying past McCudden in a head-on confrontation, however, Voss's Fokker was hit with bullets on the starboard side by Hoidge. One round pierced his right side and passed through his lungs. Nearing death, Voss did not see Rhys-Davids approach from the 6 o'clock position, directly behind his tail.
Rhys-Davids got below him and poured two drums of Lewis fire into the underside of the triplane, then attacked again with both guns. The Fokker fell away, stalled and crashed into the British line.[3] McCudden recalled: "I saw him go into a fairly steep dive and so I continued to watch, and then saw the triplane hit the ground and disappear into a thousand fragments, for it seemed to me that it literally went into powder."[6]
Voss crashed near Plum Farm north of Frezenberg in Belgium. Only the rudder, cowling, and parts of the undercarriage were salvaged; the new type of aircraft was the subject of an intelligence report by 2nd Lieutenant G. Barfoot-Saunt.
The famous Fokker F.I of Voss during his last battle.
McCudden's S.E.5 plane during the dogfight when Voss was killed.One of the British pilots he fought that day, then-Captain James McCudden, a recipient of the Victoria Cross and who would become a leading English ace of the war, expressed sincere regret at Voss's death: "His flying was wonderful, his courage magnificent and in my opinion he was the bravest German airman whom it has been my privilege to see fight." Lieutenant Arthur Rhys-Davids, who himself would fall in combat just one month later, had said to McCudden, "If I could only have brought him down alive."[6][7]
Voss did much damage to B Flight of 56 Squadron; Muspratt force-landed at No. 1 Squadron's aerodrome with a bullet in his radiator. Mayberry's SE5 was hit in the upper right hand longeron and badly damaged, force landing at St Marie Cappel. Hamersley and Chidlaw-Roberts' SE5s were badly damaged, whereas Hamersley's machine was eventually sent to No.1 Air Depot for repair. Cronyn's airplane was also damaged, as related in a letter he wrote to his father:
" After Mess I went up to the hangar to have a look at my machine. It was a write-off and no mistake. The right lower longeron had a bullet hole through it, while the left lower was nearly cut in two, either by "Archie" or bullets, but there was only about a quarter of an inch thickness left in one place, while about 18 inches further along three bullets had cut right through. The main spars were shot through, and one of the ribs of the tailplane was fractured, by the only bullet he had got into me while on or nearly on my tail. There were also several other bullet holes in wings and fuselage. Besides these few details, the machine was all OK! It was a miracle he didn't hit me in the engine. As a matter of fact he got one in my prop. I went to bed as soon as I had a good look over the machine, but could hardly sleep a wink. I just lay in bed perspiring, though it was quite a cold night.
Just some history again!
Why we build the planes we do!
Cool.
I hope to get the fuselage lacing applied tonight (if I can get a couple of free hours). I've found the type of thread/string that I like (10lb hemp) that looked good enough on my trial piece. I have it in beige, black, and dark brown. I'll use the dark brown and probably brush some green paint over top for some colour blending.
Did lots last night and started covering some parts. Didn't like the way the upper deck sat. So had to fill it with light weight body filler. Noticed that drywall compound didn't bit well to the solartex.
Was not feeling to hot last night... really wanted to get some more done on the plane and go to the scratch building course. But fell asleep from 6:30pm till 11:00 pm. So in the one hour before hitting the sack again. I managed to cover the lower part of the lower wing.
Here is some more updated images with the tail and the sub wing covered. I am using natural solartex as I needed some much to do this plane.
So here is a question. I was talking to Ron and he suggested looping the rear elevator cables to one cable that runs to the main elevator servo. If the model is covered, how can I run the other part of the cable to the left outlet to the elevator? I was thinking of attaching the end of the cable to the one end of a metal rod and pushing it into the right side of the fuse, then carefully push it through the left side. Once through, get a rod with a hook and grab the wire and pull it into the front of the fuse. At that point I can loop the cable and add the crimp. :P Sounds like a lot of work. But after spending a huge amount of $$ on pull pull systems and cables. I have to do it.
I also grabbed a Williams pilot that I will modify so that it looks like Voss. But that is a whole new project. I am still targeting the Warbirds event for mine to get painted and finished.
That looks really good, Greg, but am I seeing that the sheeted sides of the fuselage, running from the back of the round cowl, meet with the slab, framed up, sides at an angle, creating an inside angle between the sheeted area and the framed area? If so, that's going to be a problem covering unless you create a covering termination point for the flat side covering... know what I mean?
Also, are you using the Solatex as a base for painting the whole aircraft?
Re. the pull/pull wires, I'd feed through one side, through the servo arm holes, however you intend, then feed another thin wire through the opposite side (from the outside), tack glue the pull/pull wire end to end to the other wire, and carefully pull it through. One question... how do you intend to fasten the pull/pull wire to the servo arm?
Anyway, I wouldn't, and won't do it that way. I will have a separate wire per side, have a non-adjustable connection at the horns (as scale looking as I can... within reason) and use the metal clevis connection at the servo arm for tensioning and adjustment.
Robert
I hope you can see this Rob. This is how Ron told me to do it. Rudder is simple...
Quote from: Gregor77 on March 19, 2013, 08:44:01 AM
Here is some more updated images with the tail and the sub wing covered.
Wow, that looks good!
Thanks!
Here is an image of the natural Solartex on the lower wing. Due to wing night I only had a chance to do one side. I love the way the rib show...
Very nice. Is the "natural" lighter than the regular stuff, do you know?
Now that I'm bogged down with details on the SE5a (I'm working on the fuselage stitching currently) I miss the covering stage. It went well, and was quite enjoyable. Have fun!
Robert
My Werner voss decals came today from calli graphics. They are amazing. I can't wait to paint.
What's the plan? Paint , then apply the vinyl, then dull coat?
I am going to paint the model light blue using Tamiya paint. Mask the white boxes, paint them white, then mask them up again, paint the model light blue all over. Then once dry, mix up a arcylic (Thinned) dark green / med green and brown and use an old 1" brush and do the streaked paint. Once that is dry, add the decals., Get the airbrush out and add some weathering here and there. Then dull coat it with a light coat from Kyrlon. Just light misting around the decals to lock them down and reduce the glare. The nose will be dark green as for the wheels.
Once that is done, it should be good. You past question on the covering of the sides. The instructions said not to press it again the sides that bulk out. They said just have it attach to the high point and let the rest stretch over it and not against it. If that makes sense. You can see it on the images of the real Fokkers.
I'm absolutely sure it will look amazing when you've finished it.
Lower wing is now covered. Tonight is going to be the Mid wing. I guess until the servo's are installing the top wing will have to wait and the fuse. It's nice to see it almost done.. The detailing is the best part.
Well, back to this one again!
So after we flew all the big planes last week, it gave me some energy to head back in the basement and bring the DR-1 back up to the front line. I ran out of steam when it came to installing the control surfaces and left the pull pull system wires hanging all over the place. I glued in the elevator and made sure everything was level and true. Measured and re-measured! I was always a bit worried about the thrust angle and it ended up being rather easy to mount the motor as the H9 Blue nose electric motor stand offs fit perfectly. So the install only was a matter of lining up the markings and drilling some holes. With that all done, I assembled the plane to make sure it didn't warp after stilling for a year or two. It seemed find and looks good. I just need to install the ESC / SBEC and make a battery tray for inside the cowl. The fun part will be painting this one.
It's great to see, Greg!
I bet you're thinking... why didn't I do this a year ago. So easy!
;D
I got side tracked... lol! Here is one!
I have two mid wing screws where the guns generally mount.
How to I attach the machine guns?
1) Build a plate, mount the two guns and make a lip that the plate slides into and then use magnets to lock them down?
2) ? Any suggestions?
Hard to picture exactly.
What do the plans/instructions suggest. The Balsa USA instructions are usually pretty complete. Don't they offer a method for this?
This is where the instructions say "This is the time to add some scale details, but remember the more you add effects the flight characteristics of the model".. lol!
I am getting closer to completion. What paints did you guys use or are planning to use on the solartex. I have seen some poor examples online and the plane that is at PIN right now. I was planning on using light blue from Tamiya spray as a base and then a watered down acrylic from HD. Apparently BEHR ultra premium acrylic in statin is a good product. I really need It for the camo type stripes.
from all I've read you need to give the solartex a tooth with 0000 wire wool or 600 - 800 grit emory.
If you use acrylic I would consider a flat clear coat if you plan on attaching decals.
Jack.
Good suggestions, Yes, I a putting Cali decals on it when I am done.
Quote from: Papa on June 30, 2014, 10:47:51 AM
from all I've read you need to give the solartex a tooth with 0000 wire wool or 600 - 800 grit emory.
If you use acrylic I would consider a flat clear coat if you plan on attaching decals.
Jack.
I covered my Vintage oldtimer in yellow solartex and used red paint for plastic out of the rattle can. The only surface prep I did was to go over the areas to be painted with rubbing alcohol to make sure the surface was absolutely oil free. Solartex takes paint well.
Chris
So far the lower wing is painted. It took 3 can of Tamiya paint.. we are estimating about 10 cans to do the whole thing. Not cost efficient, but looks the part.
The camo will be a whole different challenge once the base colour is applied. I will need a template for this one to practice on.
Ha! Should have gone with lozenge like in Blue Max!
Seriously there has been a lot of electronic ink spilt on this topic over at theaerodrome.com. Two trains of thought. There were between 1 and 4 different colours applied in the streaks. The streaks were over clear doped linen, they were applied over the sky blue base. The streaks were dry brushed with a very dry brush or they were done as washes and the streaks came out as the brush(es) ran out of paint. There are as many theories as authors.
My guess is find a good picture of the plane you are replicating, or one whose finish is what you feel is correct. Then take a good look and decide for yourself which approach you felt was used. At that point I would make up a test panel or a few and try some different variations and see how they compare. You could photograph them and photoshop them into B&W to see how they look vs the picture(s) you are using. In reality it is you who is making the final call on what effect/look is 'correct'.
If you don't have it I have the Windsock special on Fokker Dr.I squadrons. There are good shots in there. Please note the only thing most agree on is that the streaks are straight or diagonal depending on which part of the plane you are working on. It appears to be the only consistent in the application.
There is also a theory that there was more than one person doing the final painting and each had their own approach, ie start with brush loaded with paint and go until dry, keep constant by having only a couple of brush strokes between paint loadings, etc. etc.... One wag has 'determined' the brush width. I don't remember but think they felt it was about 4" wide.
I hope this helps. I think every WWI fan has a Triplane in them somewhere/some time. If only GTM still kitted his 1/4 scale.. Oh well.
Stephen
Looking forward to some more pictures Greg!
By the way, you did not mention what happened last week at TEMAC. Last Friday we were treated to a flyby over the field by a full size Fokker DR1 Triplane (presume replica) all dressed in red. If that does not inspire you to get the job done, nothing will.
Glenn
Thanks for the information Stephen. I got most of the base colour on. I am going to start to practice a bit on a piece of scrap material first to make sure that it looks right...
Another run to HD to get some of the brown olive mixed up. I hope it is the right tint.. I don't want them to be too dark either as a big Fokekr an get lost in the clouds and lose orientation rather quickly.
Well after raiding all of southern Ontario for AS-5 tamiya paint. Ron, borgfeldt and kroegerinc finally got some more. Let me hope that is all that I need. Next time I am going with krylon. But the tamiya pigments are very light and will not add any weight to the model as other paints will. Plus it's a 99% match compared to the real plane. The hard part will be matching the dark green streaks. The colour used is called olive brown.
Nice! You should aim to have it ready for the TEMAC Fun Fly!!!
Working on it.
I thought that I would add some updated shots. I had a minute or two after the presidents BBQ last night (great turn out and lots of fun) so I finished up the Werner Voss pilot figure. I used a Williams figure and chopped it up to get the right angle. Redid the face and made the helmet with tape and white glue.
Some more shots.
I just realized. No overall image.
http://youtu.be/9RpiJL4_zRs
very cool!
If anyone has any thoughts on how to make a fake radial engine for this thing.
I was thinking the following:
- Light ply and make a moon shape
- Glue some old film cases (Round) and roll some wire around them.
- Add some rocker details on the ends
- Use a pin and slide the engine on the pin and lock with magnets.
This allows me to hide the batteries and wires. Hopefully it holds together.. lol!
This has been my greatest build to date.. I am already planning a more simplier build of the eindecker. But staring at the D7 BUSA kit beside it is tempting, but at 88" I might run out of workable space soon! I would really like to do the Urnst Udet D7 (White and red stripes).
That my friend, is absolutely stunning! Great job!
Colin