Advice to take out broken screws .....please !!!

[Bobmic]

So I am assembling a Hnagar 9 P40 and going over the manual to complete the wings but than I notice that the Eflite rotating retracts are not rotating as required - basically the spring that rotates the retracts does not have enough tension.
So I call Horizon Hobby and the guy is telling me to remove the retracts and ship them but since the supplied 4mm wooden screws that are used to attach the retracts to the wing are not the best quality two of the heads broke while trying to open them (no the screws were not glued in and I pre drilled and pre tapped the holes).
So now I have to broken screws in the retract mount on the wing - I tried to cut a slot with a dremel and use a small screwdriver but the screws are too soft and the slot doesn't hold. I also tried to drill them (although I did not push it too hard) but also did work.
Now I can drill two additional holes in the super expensive Eflite base just beside the current mounting holes but is there any other way

Any suggestion will be appreciated.
Thank you
Bobby

[Ededge2002]

Ugh that sucks.  Think your screwed. Did you try swearing at them?  It usually makes me feel a little better. 

[Bobmic]

Well... they were fine and said that they are sending a new wing and the rotating piece of the retract.... but I already clear coated the wing and added panel lines etc... so it will be nice to use it.

[thehaze]

A big thumbs up for Horizon Hobby customer service.

This is why I buy most of my kits from them.

[Bobmic]

Yes although keep in mind these retracts are almost twice the price of the plane and were faulty from the box.
The guy I talked to yesterday said that there is nothing he could do if I don't ship them back! only after insisting, sending photos and talking to another tech they actually looked into the issue and decided to send part of the retracts and the wings.

...But after all I agree - the quality is worth the money (beside the fact that this plane was cheaper than any similar model from HK)

[Bobmic]

I don't think I will have a problem if I drill two additional holes in the retract base (red or green location).
...Any idea about this option

[Michael]

Additional holes will work just fine.

Make sure the new hole in the wood is a smaller diameter than the hole in the metal; the new screw will to 'bite' into something.

To get the old screws out, try using a large pliers and carefully and slowly turn the screws out.

[Gregor77]

Besides the issue with the screws.. How is the build of the plane?  Easy, Moderate or Hard?  I have the same unit in the basement and have to finish some other planes before I jump into this one.

[Frank v B]

Bobby, 

To save the wing I would take the retract out (assuming those 2 remaining screws will back out), drill 1/6" holes around the perimeter of the broken screws, use good strong needle nose pliers and back them out.  Then drill a 1/4" hole in the same spot and squeeze in a hardwood dowel (leave it long and sticking out) with 5 minute epoxy oozing out.  Let dry overnight to harden.  Cut the dowel off flush with landing gear mount with a razor saw or Dremel cut-off wheel.  Then pre-drill the new hole and stick in a new screw.

If you drill a new hole in the retract landing gear plate and it breaks on or near your maiden flight you will have voided the warranty.

If you feel weird about doing it I will happily repair it for you.  Bring the wing to the next Pilot's meeting.

I always replace all screws in any kit (good or bad) with washer-head screws from that mail-order fastener company in the States (forgot the name because I keep the screws in unmarked film roll containers).

Getting a new wing is admitting defeat to two small screws.  Don't let them win!!

Frank

[Michael]

Frank is right.

Glue a larger dowel in a hole and then drill a new hole.

[Bobmic]

Drilling around sounds good - not sure if I will be able to get in with a needle pliers to grab it but I am sure it will release the screw eventually.
So I assume that the dowel that I will push will be strong enough. Do I use the dowel rods sold at Canadiantire or I need to look for something else?
What is the store you are ordering screws from ??

So if I understand correctly the attached picture describes what you meant?

Greg - I only put the wing together and everything was easy till now, I will let you know when I finish it.
The only problem I had was with the retracts, Horizon Hobby are shipping a new set of rotating Trunions which is the part that holds the strut and has a spring to spin it. Yesterday evening I opened the locking collar on the strut and managed to increase the tension so now it seems to be working fine.
If the first guy I talked to would have let me do that I would have fixed it on the wing without any issue but I didn't want to open anything and void the warranty.... when I knew that they are sending replacement parts there was nothing to loose.

Bobby

[Frank v B]

Bobby,

I had to call Alex Gray in Port Colbourne to get the e-mail address for the fasteners.  He bought them for me two years ago.

They are from RTL Fasteners.  I use the number 2 and number 3 screws for everything from hatches to servo mounts to canopies to landing gear on smaller planes. They come in packages of 100 and I have both sizes in two lengths (5/8 and 9/16). They are not countersunk which it looks like you need.

The web site is rtlfasteners.com

The dowel should be larger than the holes you ended up drilling depending how stubborn they were to remove.  Try to get hardwood dowels with tight grain. 

Frank

[piker]

I like the dowel suggestion.  Good idea, Frank.  The only drawback I see, other than relying on the glue joint in shear, is that the screws will be in end grain.  Still, I think it's the best solution.

I have noticed that dowels I buy at Home Depot are made from pretty soft wood these days.  Make sure you get some good, hardwoord dowels if you go this route, Bobby.

Robert

[Michael]

Drill an appropriate size hole in the dowel, screw the screw in, then remove it, and put a drop of fast-CA in the hole to harden the wood.

Wait until it is completely dry, and put the screw back in.

[Frank v B]

Piker,

You're right about the dowel and end-grain but a dowel is still the easiest way out.  To strengthen it you can put the screw in all the way, back it out, strengthen the grain with CA, let it dry and then insert the screw permanently.

If I were to do it I would get a piece of 1x2 oak out of my garage, get a plug cutter out of my tool box and make a cross grain plug just the way oak floor installers do it. 

The dowel method gets Bobby 90% of the way there much simpler and cheaper and he can count on the other 3 screws to pick up 3% extra strain and go fly.... but you're right.... as always.

Frank